Bonneville America Forums Forums Technical Forums Performance Mods Zmilins build *finally started*

Im giddy inside...

I called up Carlos at TPUSA this morning and made the first move towards real performance gains. Ive done an ungodly amount of research on everything from air filters to full engine builds and have been having conversations with Carlos for three years (two in person). The reason I call out Carlos specifically is because he has been patient the whole time (on one trip he and I were at the back of the shop for about an hour talking performance options and looking at some bad ass bikes like the TPUSA turbo salt bike). At no point did he ever get frustrated or shoo me off the phone. Has always answered emails in a timely manner and bottom line has earned my business. Never pushy but always honest. He actually likes talking to the customer a couple times before the purchase is made.

So... There are so many different ways to approach a build and I have chosen the path that makes sense to me. So... Ill explain my goals, my chosen path and Ill be coming back to this thread with updates as things happen. No, this will not be a step by step build and it will not all happen at one time. Hopefully it'll be a place where I can provide you some feedback on what I feel happening and at some point some Dyno #s.

My goal was never to have the fastest bike in Seattle or Wa or the West Coast etc... I don't need to have a cruising speed of 110 (god knows I ride fast enough as it is).
What I do need/want is to be able to move my 300+# frame and my bike in a manner so that I don't need to keep my throttle pegged or downshift when heading over a mountain pass AND certainly not to lose speed on said pass. I really want to be able to come out of a turn confidently if I forgot to downshift. Yeah, I could lose a few pounds and Im working on that but Ill never be a small guy so this is a moot point. I want better throttle response (Kawi springs are ok but it can be better) and the torque to be able to come out of a situation if needed. Ive learned that for as much as I love my bike it has some limitations but the upgrade to a R3T is not an option right now and I really don't like the T bird (yes, Ive ridden one and Im one of the few that is really not impressed with it).

I considered a 1087 but I don't want to get that deep into the motor nor can I afford a build like that right now.
I considered a 988 stroker kit but I still have to crack the cases (no machining of cases) for the crank.
Why would I do either of those and not do cams, carbs, igniter and headwork at the same time. Its just not worth it and won't perform right without the whole shebang. Do a motor like that without having the ability to stop in an efficient manner and its a recipe for disaster. Hence yet another additional cost in either a dual disc upgrade, Brembo or whatever... you get the idea.

This leads to down to the tried and true 904. I know I will end up with a 904 with head work in the end but like I said before... Im not prepared to tear that much of the bike down right now. You see... if Im taking the head off to swap the jugs I might as well do the headwork since Im in there already. If the head and jugs are off Im also sending them out for diamond cutting (I hate you Dean!!!!!). If I did all that now Im looking at a few grand and I still don't have carbs, cams or igniter done. I figure a 904 done the way I want (I said "the way I want" not the way you did it or want to do it) will be about $5-6K.

What did I do then if I didn't do the 904? I have ordered the carbs (39 FCR), 813 cams and stage 3 Igniter (reprogramed by Triumph Twin Power). All of those are bolt ons with minor invasive action on the top end. Ill get a decent HP/Tq bump with proven products that don't require heavy tweaking. TPUSA has done enough set ups like this that they know how to set the carbs so its really a swap. Another reason for my options are that (to me) it makes sense to have the air and fuel deliver available before I exceed those capabilities. The motor can take more air (most of us have some sort of intake mod) and expel said air through a more open exhaust system (which I have). We have fuel but its proven that more fuel even in our OEM (Im referring to the 865) motors is beneficial. An added bonus to the carbs now is throttle response. Yes there is a cheaper carb option but there have not been good things said of the larger CR carbs but those FCRs get rave reviews even on their own. The igniter will raise my redline and advance my timing which will benefit the cams and will be good for a couple HP and Tq points. Cams are cams and will open those valves longer to get that extra air/fuel in there to burn up.

I did learn that those pesky billet intakes that we keep debating about can be used if the air box is out. They are not usable if the air box is in. This made me happy cause I was thinking those OEM intake manifolds would be a choke point.

It has been estimated that my current mods will allow for upwards of a 10hp increase and possibly the same for Tq. This is where the dyno will come into play. Ill need to do a baseline run but don't know if the shop will be able to get me in on such short notice so this may need to be a seat of pants sort of thing.

Wish me luck!

My gawd, you sure can out 'tech-talk' me. What was that again? Anyway, I know you've wanted to dig into that motor for a while now. Good to hear you're going at 'er and, as per request... GOOD LUCK!

PS... Can you post a video of you being giddy? I'd love to see that!

Good luck & have fun.

Z, I'm gonna give you the honest truth. It doesn't matter what you do now, because after you ride it for a while and get used to the new power, you'll be thinking, "what can I do to get a couple more ponies out of this?"

just a heads up

Ha. Dave is so right. It's inevitable, unavoidable, and insatiable.

But, do enjoy your endeavor and I look forward to your updates.

Dammit, link won't work.

Mods, please delete.

Have fun, looking forward to seeing your progress.

I'm happy with my CR carbs looking forward to "first chapter" after this long-ish "introduction"

Right on Z, can't wait to see how it turns out.

I'm just to lazy much easier just to buy a bigger bike! BUT would love to see the mods you end up doing!

Sounds great.

Are you going to add one at a time, say carb and take it out for a test ride, then add cam etc... or are you just going to install the whole shbang and go riding? Just wondering.

Yep Z....I think everybody will be watching with some interest in how things progress. Would be great to actually see the difference in performance adding things incrementally if possible.

Good luck and have fun.

Z, did you already do a baseline dyno run?

I did one a couple years ago but the printer was broken so I don't have a hard copy and I don't remember the numbers. I do know that I was happy to be at the average for a 865 with pipes and freak.

Im gonna try and squeeze in this week if I can. If not then its outta my hands.

Of course you'll be shooting lots of video, right?

Well, not exactly a how-to video. I don't think anyone expects that much effort.

Have fun Z! Don't forget that a bike is always only a couple hundred bucks, or a couple horses from being perfect! Enjoy..

Z, a couple years ago I took a spin on a standard Bonnie that Matt had done exactly what you're gonna do with your BA(just the hotter cams, the CR carbs and the igniter) and I gotta say I came away impressed with the power delivery and the extra power it afforded by just those mods alone. I think you'll be impressed too.

(...and yeah, you're right about Carlos...a great guy who's always friendly, is knowledgeable and loves talkin' bikes!)

OH, btw...have you been to the new location yet? It's quite a step up in all regards from that little place Matt used to have just down the road on PCH there.

SWEET! I got a dyno run scheduled for tomorrow so I can get a baseline run on my bike.

Don't lose the dyno sheet!

Here they are. Two printouts, one with a/f the other shows HP/Tq for the two best of three runs.
I could have sworn that when I did a free dyno run a couple years ago my HP was closer to 55hp. I don't think I had the Thruxton needles back then and I doubt needles cost me 5hp. Anyway, not a big concern as there are more better things coming soon

Bike specifics: 07 America, 865cc, K&N pods (with rain socks), 150/45 jetting, Thruxton needles and Specialty Spares long cannons.
peak HP: 50.74
peak Tq: 49.27
Theres a nice little lean spike at 2500rpm then another minor one at about 4200rpm. Otherwise it looks like Ive been pretty rich. I expected this and since Im upgrading to the FCRs Im not going to mess with it.

The important thing is to do all your dyno runs on the same machine, ideally in similar weather conditions. You have a solid foundation to start with, higher numbers than my first run.

Im not worried about the numbers. The bike has been running like a beast and Ive been very happy with it... but now theres going to be more.


Only problem now is waiting... jeez. I just got to all boxed up and ready to go out tomorrow and Im already anxious.

Don't worry about the roll-on lean spike at 2500; ignore that.

You might want to ask the dyno operator why he ran the numbers with a smoothing factor of 4 instead of the usual & customary 5.

Also, your bike actually made more power than the numbers show, as your runs have a negative correction factor (.95).

You're gonna love your new bike