Interesting how those of you who believe the terrorists cant be beat ( defeatists sounds like a fair label ) seem to ignore that they are state sponsored, so to defeat them is onot only to beat them down where you see them, but to also confront their sponsors, who it coincidentally seems, want confrontation.

Bayern, my comment was to that you said we are creating new terrorists, and that I find that a defeatist view. We are not at fault. Islam has been at war with the non Muslim world since its inception. It conquered Christian lands throughout the Middle East, across North Africa, up the Iberian Peninsula and on to Tours where they were defeated in 732AD by forces led by Charles Martel (Charlemagne's grandfather ). They also moved across to Europe through Greece and up the Balkans and a couple of times to Vienna ( one time the defeat of the Muslim forces and end of siege was commemorated by a special pastry, the croussaint ). They also moved to east through Persia and on to the Indian subcontinent.They also moved south into Africa. The Muslims did, for centuries, continue to sail around the the various lands, raid the towns and cities, rob, plunder and captured locals to make slaves. This war is their fault and has been a continuous act of Islamic aggression against the world. For example, they still lay claim to Spain ( they were kicked out in 1492, does that year spark anything, it isnt coincidence ), and have said so recently in their rhetoric in regards to the attacks there. As a culture, they are backward and have not advanced, the West has greatly advanced and we have reaped the benefits of that progress ( just look at how at one time, the Inquisition took place, the burnings of witches, mistakes and now recognized as such and wont occur again. Islam doesnt have that self examination, it wont allow for it, and that is really too bad, as they can tprogress with out it ).


Our Liberties We Prize and Our Rights We Will Maintain If a nation expects to be ignorant and free, in a state of civilization, it expects what never was and will never be.----Thomas Jefferson