 Polaris kills Victory
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Who didn't see this coming? I believe I predicted this when Indian was relaunched. LINK
Last edited by outerbanks; 01/09/2017 12:59 PM.
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Re: Polaris kills Victory
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Fe Butt
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I thought they mi9ght turn the Victory into an even more modern design while keeping Indian nostagic.
I learned all I need to know about life by killing smart people and eating their brains.
Eat right ,Exercise ,Stay fit, Die Anyway!
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Re: Polaris kills Victory
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It makes sense to market and focus on one brand and not split available resources between two or worse sell the same bike under both brands like the Scout/Octane twins. But they definitely should keep elements of Victory like the Vegas and possibly the standard baggers rebadge them as new Indians and fill out the rest of the gaps in the Indian line. They're good bikes that have been fully developed and with small trim changes would make great Indians.
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Re: Polaris kills Victory
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If you've been wanting a new Victory now is the time $2000 cash back 80% off select accessories and 60% off apparel. It's liquidation time!
Edit, $10.000 cash back on the Empulse TT. !!
Last edited by outerbanks; 01/09/2017 3:38 PM.
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Re: Polaris kills Victory
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Loquacious
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Quote:
Who didn't see this coming? I believe I predicted this when Indian was relaunched. LINK
Yep...sad, but true.
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Re: Polaris kills Victory
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Loquacious
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Dinosaur.
"Oh Man I only ride 'em.I don't know what makes 'em work". Donald "Oddball" Sutherland
"Don't let the bastards get you down". Kris Kristofferson
"I am only paranoid because everyone is against me". Larry [Frank Burns] Linville
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Re: Polaris kills Victory
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Monkey Butt
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Monkey Butt
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Quote:
It makes sense to market and focus on one brand and not split available resources between two or worse sell the same bike under both brands like the Scout/Octane twins. But they definitely should keep elements of Victory like the Vegas and possibly the standard baggers rebadge them as new Indians and fill out the rest of the gaps in the Indian line. They're good bikes that have been fully developed and with small trim changes would make great Indians.
Different motor. The Freedom 106 has no similarity to the Thunder stroke 111. Other than the scout, I am thinking the motor is a big part of the motorcycle. I think all of Victory is simply gone.
I try to aggravate one person a day. Today may be your day.
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Re: Polaris kills Victory
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Worn Saddle
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Worn Saddle
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I'm surprised. I thought they would market Victory as the "modern" type stuff, AKA, Vision and so forth and promote Indian for the nostalgia crowd. I suppose one can do both under one name. I suppose.
Fidelis et Fortis
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Re: Polaris kills Victory
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Quote:
Quote:
It makes sense to market and focus on one brand and not split available resources between two or worse sell the same bike under both brands like the Scout/Octane twins. But they definitely should keep elements of Victory like the Vegas and possibly the standard baggers rebadge them as new Indians and fill out the rest of the gaps in the Indian line. They're good bikes that have been fully developed and with small trim changes would make great Indians.
Different motor. The Freedom 106 has no similarity to the Thunder stroke 111. Other than the scout, I am thinking the motor is a big part of the motorcycle. I think all of Victory is simply gone.
Of course it is a different motor all motorcycle manufacturers have a variety of engines in their line. Look at the variety of engines Triumph has across their various models.
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Re: Polaris kills Victory
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3/4 Throttle
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Victory was a good Motorcycle hate to see it happen.I know our dealer here did not fair too well with them.The Indians sold good in our area and I suppose they will keep that line. http://www.startribune.com/polaris-says-...rand/410139155/
Last edited by Donny; 01/09/2017 10:34 PM.
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Re: Polaris kills Victory
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3/4 Throttle
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The Indian/Victory Dealer across from my office let the Triumph distributorship go last year. Now he looses Victory. If Indian is going to be a one trick pony they better have some new models on the way soon.
Road Rash Heals. Freckles Grow Back. Ride
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Re: Polaris kills Victory
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Monkey Butt
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Monkey Butt
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I wonder if they will let all those Victory dealers become Indian dealers.
We all like to think of ourselves as rugged individualists. But when push comes to shove most of us are sheep who do what we are told. Worst of all, a lot of us become unpaid agents of whoever is controlling the agenda by enforcing the current dogma on the few rugged individualists who actually exist.
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Re: Polaris kills Victory
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Monkey Butt
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Monkey Butt
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Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
It makes sense to market and focus on one brand and not split available resources between two or worse sell the same bike under both brands like the Scout/Octane twins. But they definitely should keep elements of Victory like the Vegas and possibly the standard baggers rebadge them as new Indians and fill out the rest of the gaps in the Indian line. They're good bikes that have been fully developed and with small trim changes would make great Indians.
Different motor. The Freedom 106 has no similarity to the Thunder stroke 111. Other than the scout, I am thinking the motor is a big part of the motorcycle. I think all of Victory is simply gone.
Of course it is a different motor all motorcycle manufacturers have a variety of engines in their line. Look at the variety of engines Triumph has across their various models.
Triumph does have different motors. Motors cost a bunch to develop. Polaris likes to limit drive lines for production simplicity.
Indian Cruisers have the Thunder Stroke. They will never let that motor compete with the Freedom 106 on the same showroom under the same badge. It would send a message that the Thunder Stroke was lacking so they adopted the Freedom motor.
Now that 1133 liquid motor in the Scout puts out RW 90HP and could go into other bikes still being the other engine Indian already makes.
I don't disagree with you, for another 3500 bucks you can make a Freedom 106 run about 140HP. It is a waste to throw that motor away, but I predict they will. Or use it in a little ATV application.
I try to aggravate one person a day. Today may be your day.
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Re: Polaris kills Victory
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Quote:
Victory was a good Motorcycle hate to see it happen.I know our dealer here did not fair too well with them.The Indians sold good in our area and I suppose they will keep that line.
http://www.startribune.com/polaris-says-...rand/410139155/
Quotes from the article you cited:
"Sales of Victory had peaked in 2012 before the introduction of Indian in 2013. And Victory had declined each year after that, with the business being unprofitable … for three of the last five years," Translation: Indian was taking the bulk of their new customers from Victory cannibalizing the other Polaris company.
"The decision to shut down the Victory line did not surprise Wall Street analysts. The end of Victory is just "as some in the industry had conjectured since the launch of Indian," said UBS analyst Robin Farley."
And to prove motorcycles are only a small part of Polaris' business and therefore very expendable both Indian and Victory...
"Motorcycles now represent about 15 percent of Polaris' annual revenue of $4.7 billion."
But all is not bad, IF they carryover the Vegas platform cruisers from Victory to Indian look for future Polaris quarterly reports to brag about "explosive growth in Indian sales" as Victory buyers look only at Indian. The key here is to round out the Indian line, if they are the only brand they have to provide price competitive full size cruisers and baggers positioned just below the lowest (current) Indian models. That means keeping the solid performing and paid for Victory Freedom 106/6-speed powertrain in bikes like the $13,000 Vegas 8-Ball.
This is be the best move Polaris could have done to stay in the motorcycle market and keep the people at Spirit Lake working.
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Re: Polaris kills Victory
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I would like Indian to bring out a "normal"looking model, the big Injuns are just too Retro for my taste. I think the loss of Victory shows how hard it is to compete with Harley for any cruiser. A darn shame.
Tin Man 2
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Re: Polaris kills Victory
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I would like Indian to bring out a "normal"looking model, the big Injuns are just too Retro for my taste. I think the loss of Victory shows how hard it is to compete with Harley for any cruiser. A darn shame.
Agreed, I just can't get past the big Indian's styling. Like a late '50s car overdone with fender skirts...or a Vespa. LoL
Last edited by outerbanks; 01/10/2017 10:38 AM.
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Re: Polaris kills Victory
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Saddle Sore
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Lot's of hubbub where Triumph is heading with the cruiser line. This maybe an opportunity for them to re-access their direction.
However, I'm sure industry insiders knew this was coming and honestly would anyone be surprised if Indian was discontinued in a few years for the twelfth time.
Let's face it, it's not like the Polaris Indian is cheaper than an HD. Maybe the Vic MC dealers can bring in that god awful looking Slingshot.
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Re: Polaris kills Victory
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Loquacious
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Quote:
Who didn't see this coming? I believe I predicted this when Indian was relaunched. LINK
Frankly, the brain trust at Polaris didn't see it coming. I'm referring to interviews with Polaris leadership just a couple of years past. I can't quote them verbatim, but the sentiment was that Victory wasn't going away.
I can tell you this, the Victory faithful are p!ssed! Many of them have already sworn off all Polaris products until further notice.
As you might imagine, I'm not happy. 
Kevin - Luceo Non Uro
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Indian is and will continue to do just fine, In the high end market name is everything, besides the fact that the Indian is a darn good bike.
Tin Man 2
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Re: Polaris kills Victory
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Loquacious
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Indian is and will continue to do just fine, In the high end market name is everything, besides the fact that the Indian is a darn good bike.
Indian is a great bike for sure. I've got a Roadmaster and it is an awesome machine. But as we always say, it's still not a Vision.
Kevin - Luceo Non Uro
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Re: Polaris kills Victory
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Monkey Butt
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Monkey Butt
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This bike is not too retro at 90HP and a consistent 64lbs of torque. 
I try to aggravate one person a day. Today may be your day.
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Re: Polaris kills Victory
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Monkey Butt
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Monkey Butt
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Quote:
Quote:
Who didn't see this coming? I believe I predicted this when Indian was relaunched. LINK
Frankly, the brain trust at Polaris didn't see it coming. I'm referring to interviews with Polaris leadership just a couple of years past. I can't quote them verbatim, but the sentiment was that Victory wasn't going away.
I can tell you this, the Victory faithful are p!ssed! Many of them have already sworn off all Polaris products until further notice.
As you might imagine, I'm not happy.
I take it you have been reading the forum. The Victory owners are pissed!
I try to aggravate one person a day. Today may be your day.
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Re: Polaris kills Victory
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Maybe Polaris has decided that they didn't want any competition in the big cruiser market and only want to offer the Indian after they buy out Harley Davidson? Food for thought?
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Re: Polaris kills Victory
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Loquacious
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Quote:
Quote:
Quote:
Who didn't see this coming? I believe I predicted this when Indian was relaunched. LINK
Frankly, the brain trust at Polaris didn't see it coming. I'm referring to interviews with Polaris leadership just a couple of years past. I can't quote them verbatim, but the sentiment was that Victory wasn't going away.
I can tell you this, the Victory faithful are p!ssed! Many of them have already sworn off all Polaris products until further notice.
As you might imagine, I'm not happy.
I take it you have been reading the forum. The Victory owners are pissed!
Yep. And even more so on Facebook. 
Kevin - Luceo Non Uro
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Re: Polaris kills Victory
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3/4 Throttle
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Maybe Polaris has decided that they didn't want any competition in the big cruiser market and only want to offer the Indian after they buy out Harley Davidson? Food for thought?
Now that would make a great fake news story.
Polaris buys Harley Davidson Motorcycle. New Harleys will have the Freedom 106 engine.
That would be awesome to stir the pot.
Road Rash Heals. Freckles Grow Back. Ride
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Re: Polaris kills Victory
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Quote:
Quote:
Maybe Polaris has decided that they didn't want any competition in the big cruiser market and only want to offer the Indian after they buy out Harley Davidson? Food for thought?
Now that would make a great fake news story.
Polaris buys Harley Davidson Motorcycle. New Harleys will have the Freedom 106 engine.
That would be awesome to stir the pot.
Actually a far better story would be if the real motorcycle enthusiasts within Victory/Indian bought the brand from Polaris and built it to become one of the biggest motorcycle companies in the world...like Willie and the boys did when they bought Harley Davidson back from AMF.
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Re: Polaris kills Victory
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Quote:
Quote:
Who didn't see this coming? I believe I predicted this when Indian was relaunched. LINK
Frankly, the brain trust at Polaris didn't see it coming. I'm referring to interviews with Polaris leadership just a couple of years past. I can't quote them verbatim, but the sentiment was that Victory wasn't going away.
I can tell you this, the Victory faithful are p!ssed! Many of them have already sworn off all Polaris products until further notice.
As you might imagine, I'm not happy.
Executives can't publicly admit their marketing plan as it would weaken confidence in both brands. I was in Sturgis when Polaris launched Indian in Aug 2013 and man they spared no expense but they couldn't come right out and say "as soon as Indian gets a foothold and the infrastructure is in place we're going to shut down Victory." And Victory was a fall back position just in case Indian failed again. They let both brands exist albeit with Indian getting the lions share of resources, Indian got the Scout before Victory got the Octane for example but with the motorcycle market being tough for everyone lately the time was right to make the split.
That doesn't comfort the Victory fans though. It was like when General Motors decided to terminate their Pontiac brand (and keep Buick -yuck!) all of those Firebird, GTO etc fans were furious.
Now Indian alone is going to have to do what both brands did before. That means Indian is going to have to change a bit but if they do it right Indian will be stronger than both brands were individually.
I just hope Polaris stays committed given motorcycles are only 15% of their business.
Last edited by outerbanks; 01/11/2017 4:07 AM.
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Re: Polaris kills Victory
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This bike is not too retro at 90HP and a consistent 64lbs of torque.
The Scout is outstanding! The power is good but the Scout is exactly where Indian styling needs to go. The Scout is the definition of Art Deco! It's like looking at the top of the Chrysler building, the Scout is retro done right and it's unlike any other motorcycle style.
Last edited by outerbanks; 01/11/2017 4:02 AM.
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Ok, the joking will now begin! You just blew $20,000 on a brand new Victory?! HaHaHaHa !!  
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Re: Polaris kills Victory
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Loquacious
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Loquacious
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Quote:
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I just hope Polaris stays committed given motorcycles are only 15% of their business.
Yep.
There are a number of Victory haters on Indians and these guys
A. Don't realize the same guys that designed and built Victory are the same ones that designed and built Indian, and
B. The same thing could happen to Indian (or Slingshot!) in a heartbeat if it was not profitable.
Just a prediction, now that there is no Victory watch for a metamorphosis of the 106 power train to show up in a future Indian...
 
Kevin - Luceo Non Uro
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The Scout is a decent looking bike, but I liked the Octane better. I was hoping for a full size Indian, without the over done styling. My guess is it will come soon and round out the line up.
Tin Man 2
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Re: Polaris kills Victory
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Worn Saddle
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Worn Saddle
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"That doesn't comfort the Victory fans though. It was like when General Motors decided to terminate their Pontiac brand (and keep Buick -yuck!) all of those Firebird, GTO etc fans were furious."
Because to stay in business you have to make the ones that sell?
A positive attitude may not solve all your problems, but it will annoy enough people to make it worth the effort. Herm Albright (1876 - 1944)
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Re: Polaris kills Victory
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"That doesn't comfort the Victory fans though. It was like when General Motors decided to terminate their Pontiac brand (and keep Buick -yuck!) all of those Firebird, GTO etc fans were furious."
Because to stay in business you have to make the ones that sell?
True, just so long as the division isn't starved of resources and product by the parent company causing the failure. In the case of GM Buick had nowhere near the potential that the Pontiac brand had. But at least all of the blue haired old ladies can trade their aging Mercury Grand Marquis in on Buicks.
Indian got a mid size cruiser in their second year while Victory waited 16 years to get the hand me down Octane.
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Re: Polaris kills Victory
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Worn Saddle
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Buick is the top selling GM badge in a country of over 1.6 billion people. That's really big potential.
A positive attitude may not solve all your problems, but it will annoy enough people to make it worth the effort. Herm Albright (1876 - 1944)
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Re: Polaris kills Victory
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Buick is the top selling GM badge in a country of over 1.6 billion people. That's really big potential.
Only in China. GM should use the Buick name brand for China like they used Opel in Europe and Holden in Australia but not in their home market. In America Buicks come with AARP cards.
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Re: Polaris kills Victory
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Quote:
Quote:
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I just hope Polaris stays committed given motorcycles are only 15% of their business.
Yep.
There are a number of Victory haters on Indians and these guys
A. Don't realize the same guys that designed and built Victory are the same ones that designed and built Indian, and
B. The same thing could happen to Indian (or Slingshot!) in a heartbeat if it was not profitable.
Just a prediction, now that there is no Victory watch for a metamorphosis of the 106 power train to show up in a future Indian...
Yes of course, that's what I was talking about earlier.
Times are tight in the motorcycle market and the Polaris board can carryover the entire Victory Vegas platform and powertrain with just a restyle and upgraded trim materials launch "all new" Indians at a fraction of the normal development cost. The bonus is since they've already had all of the problems worked out there won't be the usual new model teething issues. But they have to restyle the bikes so it's not obvious they're just rebadged and so they look like Indians not Victorys...but hold the fender skirts please.
Last edited by outerbanks; 01/12/2017 6:28 AM.
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Re: Polaris kills Victory
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Worn Saddle
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Worn Saddle
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In America Buicks come with AARP cards.
So do I, 15 year member now. And like Polaris, GM chose the route of sustainable profit. How's your business model doing?
A positive attitude may not solve all your problems, but it will annoy enough people to make it worth the effort. Herm Albright (1876 - 1944)
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Re: Polaris kills Victory
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In America Buicks come with AARP cards.
So do I, 15 year member now. And like Polaris, GM chose the route of sustainable profit. How's your business model doing?
My business model? Well I'm certainly not rich but very comfortable thank you. Own our home at the beach 2 Harley Davidsons my F150 and my wife's convertible Mustang oh, and we're on our third boat. So life is good! Not a government worker so all done without taxpayer money.
Unlike Government Motors GM I've never been bankrupt or needed a bailout.
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Re: Polaris kills Victory
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Fe Butt
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Fe Butt
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In America Buicks come with AARP cards.
Too bad really, Buick used to have some great muscle cars. The Wildcat and the Skylark GS and GSX. There was a hotrod Regal too among others.
I learned all I need to know about life by killing smart people and eating their brains.
Eat right ,Exercise ,Stay fit, Die Anyway!
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Yea Dog, There is still argument about what was faster the Mopar Hemi's or the Buick 455's. Buick still sells a Hot Regal but I have never drove one.
Tin Man 2
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