 Don't make 'em like they use to
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Joined: Apr 2008
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Loquacious
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OP
Loquacious
Joined: Apr 2008
Posts: 3,937 |
Thursday night I heard some "noise" coming from the bike (No, the wife was not with me) and decided I should check it out today.
All I noticed is that the drive chain had too much slack, so I was going to adjust it. Without my helper to hold the bike upright for my second of two checks for alignment [which is two straight edge bars mounted to the rear tire, and run past the front tire (the other is a straight edge on the drive chain, from rear sprocket to drive sprocket)] I decided to wait till they are here tomorrow, and I just lubed the chain, while the rear wheel was off the ground.
Wiping off the excess lube, I noticed a kink in one link of the chain. Not bad, as I could straighten it easily, but it would do it every revolution. Maybe due to lack of attention (I "lube" the chain probably once a year, or about every 4k miles.), maybe do to age.
Tomorrow, I'll take it off and check the stretch.
It's the OEM chain on my '05 (bought "almost new" in '07), and only has 29.8k on it.
And you may see me tonight
With an illegal smile
J. Prine
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Re: Don't make 'em like they use to
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Joined: Oct 2012
Posts: 459 Likes: 1
Adjunct
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Adjunct
Joined: Oct 2012
Posts: 459 Likes: 1 |
If that is 29.8k miles then I would say that you got use out of that one.
2006 865 Neon Blue/Jet Black Speedmaster,790cams, TTP Stage 2 Firestarter, Epco Exhaust with 10.25" Samson Vrod baffles, UNI pods with 40 pilots, 150 mains,Thruxton needles, 3 turns out.
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Re: Don't make 'em like they use to
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Joined: Jul 2007
Posts: 6,060 Likes: 6
Worn Saddle
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Worn Saddle
Joined: Jul 2007
Posts: 6,060 Likes: 6 |
Yep, you're due for a chain! Mine started to do that at 24 K, and like you, I lubed it every 3 to 4 K.
Fidelis et Fortis
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Re: Don't make 'em like they use to
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Joined: Feb 2007
Posts: 23,243 Likes: 64
Fe Butt
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Fe Butt
Joined: Feb 2007
Posts: 23,243 Likes: 64 |
I changed mine before it did that at over 23000 and I never cleaned or lubed mine.
I learned all I need to know about life by killing smart people and eating their brains.
Eat right ,Exercise ,Stay fit, Die Anyway!
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Re: Don't make 'em like they use to
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Joined: Nov 2014
Posts: 25
Greenhorn
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Greenhorn
Joined: Nov 2014
Posts: 25 |
can't properly lube an o ring chain without soaking it
Life may begin at 30, but it gets really interesting around 150!
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Re: Don't make 'em like they use to
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Joined: Feb 2008
Posts: 2,671 Likes: 15
Loquacious
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Loquacious
Joined: Feb 2008
Posts: 2,671 Likes: 15 |
Quote:
... OEM chain on my '05 (bought "almost new" in '07), and only has 29.8k on it.
Good God Erle, you got your money's worth from it! 
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Re: Don't make 'em like they use to
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Joined: Feb 2007
Posts: 23,243 Likes: 64
Fe Butt
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Fe Butt
Joined: Feb 2007
Posts: 23,243 Likes: 64 |
Quote:
can't properly lube an o ring chain without soaking it
Our bikes come with an X ring chain, that type of chain is sealed even better than an O ring chain. The seal on an X ring has more sealing ridges. If you lube one the only reason would be to prevent rust but I found that if you don't clean them before you install them you don't need to do that either. I also think by lubing them you give dirt something to adhere to actually causing more wear. After over 23,000 miles my rear sprocket showed no visible wear and the front only very little wear and this was with no lube at all and never cleaned except what ever hit it when I washed the bike or rain.
I learned all I need to know about life by killing smart people and eating their brains.
Eat right ,Exercise ,Stay fit, Die Anyway!
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Re: Don't make 'em like they use to
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Joined: May 2010
Posts: 5,720
Check Pants
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Check Pants
Joined: May 2010
Posts: 5,720 |
I'm not real sure it possible to lube the internals of an o ring chain, the same rubber seal that keeps the miniscule amount of grease the chain comes with, will inhibit any new lubricant from entering the internal barrel and pin component of the chain. All one can accomplish is to slick up the contact areas of the sprockets and chain. Any substance that attracts and accumulates grit, speeds up wear in that respect. I use a baked on teflon/moly coating for guns from Brownells on the sprockets and leave the chain dry. Do my methods have any real lubrication benefits, I really have no clue. So when my chain stretches excessively, compared along side a new example I have hanging on a finish nail, I change the sprockets and chain out. The worst thing you can do is to use a spray solvent like WD-40 and wash the petroleum component out of the factory grease and that I'm relatively sure of from experience and just don't practice.
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Re: Don't make 'em like they use to
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Joined: Apr 2007
Posts: 3,063 Likes: 8
Loquacious
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Loquacious
Joined: Apr 2007
Posts: 3,063 Likes: 8 |
When I changed my chain at around 38,000 kilometers I didn't replace the rear sprocket. When I sold the bike at 57k it still had the original rear sprocket. Looked like new. I only used chain wax. Doesn't do anything to the internals of an x ring chain but it does help lube the sprockets. If I was riding on dirt roads though, I'd use nothing on the chain.
12 Rocket Roadster
03 Bonneville America
69 BSA Firebird Scrambler
73 Yamaha TX 750
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Re: Don't make 'em like they use to
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Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 10,735 Likes: 7
Should be Riding
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Should be Riding
Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 10,735 Likes: 7 |
I get less than 20 thousand out of a chain, but I'm pretty heavy handed with the throttle
Always remember to be yourself. Unless you suck. Then pretend to be someone else.
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Re: Don't make 'em like they use to
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Joined: May 2010
Posts: 5,720
Check Pants
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Check Pants
Joined: May 2010
Posts: 5,720 |
I have wondered if Thunderbird Sport sprockets are a plug and play swap? A 530 pitched chain would ostensibly last longer than a 525P, experiencing the same pattern of service due to it s higher specs and greater bearing surfaces.
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Re: Don't make 'em like they use to
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Joined: Feb 2007
Posts: 23,243 Likes: 64
Fe Butt
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Fe Butt
Joined: Feb 2007
Posts: 23,243 Likes: 64 |
I wondered that myself having always run 530 in the past.
I learned all I need to know about life by killing smart people and eating their brains.
Eat right ,Exercise ,Stay fit, Die Anyway!
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Re: Don't make 'em like they use to
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Joined: Oct 2012
Posts: 459 Likes: 1
Adjunct
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Adjunct
Joined: Oct 2012
Posts: 459 Likes: 1 |
The rear sprocket will bolt right up as the TBS and America/Speedmasters use the same sprocket carrier. The front sprocket would be the one in question as the TBS and America/Speedmasters use different gearbox output shafts. The 43 tooth TBS rear sprocket is also different from the 43 tooth rear sprocket of the Bonnevilles.
2006 865 Neon Blue/Jet Black Speedmaster,790cams, TTP Stage 2 Firestarter, Epco Exhaust with 10.25" Samson Vrod baffles, UNI pods with 40 pilots, 150 mains,Thruxton needles, 3 turns out.
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Re: Don't make 'em like they use to
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Joined: Apr 2007
Posts: 3,063 Likes: 8
Loquacious
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Loquacious
Joined: Apr 2007
Posts: 3,063 Likes: 8 |
I thought the TBS used a 42 rear sprocket as stock?
12 Rocket Roadster
03 Bonneville America
69 BSA Firebird Scrambler
73 Yamaha TX 750
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Re: Don't make 'em like they use to
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Joined: May 2010
Posts: 5,720
Check Pants
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Check Pants
Joined: May 2010
Posts: 5,720 |
So, evidently, it isn't an easy swap over, to a 530 pitched chain?
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Re: Don't make 'em like they use to
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Joined: Feb 2007
Posts: 23,243 Likes: 64
Fe Butt
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Fe Butt
Joined: Feb 2007
Posts: 23,243 Likes: 64 |
I seem to remember sprockets available that are a bolt on swap but I don't remember from what anymore or who sold them. I think the rear one was aluminum, though and wore fast.
I learned all I need to know about life by killing smart people and eating their brains.
Eat right ,Exercise ,Stay fit, Die Anyway!
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Re: Don't make 'em like they use to
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Joined: May 2010
Posts: 5,720
Check Pants
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Check Pants
Joined: May 2010
Posts: 5,720 |
I bought a Aluminum rear sprocket from Fast Eddy and I have 15,000 miles on it so far. I thought Eddy was going to make me sign a hold harmless agreement for upfront knowledge of fast wear. He puts his reputation on the line for everything he sells. Not a bad way to do business, IMO.
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Re: Don't make 'em like they use to
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Joined: Oct 2012
Posts: 459 Likes: 1
Adjunct
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Adjunct
Joined: Oct 2012
Posts: 459 Likes: 1 |
Quote:
I thought the TBS used a 42 rear sprocket as stock?
According to the parts fiche the replacement stock part number lists as a 43 but it does note to check the toothe count.
http://www.2wheelpros.com/oem-parts/2004...e-assembly.html
2006 865 Neon Blue/Jet Black Speedmaster,790cams, TTP Stage 2 Firestarter, Epco Exhaust with 10.25" Samson Vrod baffles, UNI pods with 40 pilots, 150 mains,Thruxton needles, 3 turns out.
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Re: Don't make 'em like they use to
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Joined: Sep 2015
Posts: 797 Likes: 17
3/4 Throttle
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3/4 Throttle
Joined: Sep 2015
Posts: 797 Likes: 17 |
While we are on this topic. When I got my bike in September the guy gave me some chain lube. Looks like he sprayed it down and it just sat. I was going to just take the chain off and drop it in a can of Kerosene and brush it down. (Like I did in the old days) If it is sealed and I am only concerned with cleaning the outside an putting some fresh chain lube on I should be fine. Right? It just looks nasty at the moment. The old lube is caked on it.
Last edited by BillyIndiana; 12/20/2015 12:28 PM.
Road Rash Heals. Freckles Grow Back. Ride
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Re: Don't make 'em like they use to
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Joined: May 2007
Posts: 5,068 Likes: 1
Saddle Sore
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Saddle Sore
Joined: May 2007
Posts: 5,068 Likes: 1 |
Soaking it in kerosene will wash out the innard internal lubed up goo stuff and will soak in and wreak havoc with the chain innards. Just clean it up with a judicial amount of cleaner with an old toothbrush, or you could use your good toothbrush, just wash it off with kerosene. Four out of five dentists surveyed recommended stiffer bristles when you clean your chain, the results are dazzling ! 
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Re: Don't make 'em like they use to
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Joined: Sep 2015
Posts: 797 Likes: 17
3/4 Throttle
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3/4 Throttle
Joined: Sep 2015
Posts: 797 Likes: 17 |
OK I got some old scrub brushes that will do the job. I know it just needs all the junk kleened off the outside.
Why would anyone kleen a toothbrush? that would be like rinsing a razor?
Figured I would do that when I change the front sprocket. I want to try a 19 tooth. I keep trying to shift into 6th gear.
Road Rash Heals. Freckles Grow Back. Ride
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Re: Don't make 'em like they use to
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Joined: May 2010
Posts: 5,720
Check Pants
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Check Pants
Joined: May 2010
Posts: 5,720 |
Go with a bigger diameter rear tire and that 6th gear business will go away.
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Re: Don't make 'em like they use to
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Joined: Apr 2007
Posts: 3,063 Likes: 8
Loquacious
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Loquacious
Joined: Apr 2007
Posts: 3,063 Likes: 8 |
Quote:
Quote:
I thought the TBS used a 42 rear sprocket as stock?
According to the parts fiche the replacement stock part number lists as a 43 but it does note to check the toothe count.
http://www.2wheelpros.com/oem-parts/2004...e-assembly.html
Opps, my mistake. It's the America and Speedy that use a 42 tooth rear sprocket.
12 Rocket Roadster
03 Bonneville America
69 BSA Firebird Scrambler
73 Yamaha TX 750
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Re: Don't make 'em like they use to
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Joined: May 2010
Posts: 5,720
Check Pants
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Check Pants
Joined: May 2010
Posts: 5,720 |
Makes sense that a TBS has 43T rear sprockets, the rear tires stock are 17". I run 16/43 on both of the speedy s I have with 16" rears. I didn't like the tall 1st gear that evolved with the increased tire circumference. A high geared 1st is harder on the clutch packs too.
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Re: Don't make 'em like they use to
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Joined: Feb 2006
Posts: 1,690
Learned Hand
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Learned Hand
Joined: Feb 2006
Posts: 1,690 |
I've replaced the chain on my 2005 about 3 times now, and in under a week, or about 100 miles, the chain "kinks" in several places...Have never been able to understand it. I asked other riders at a couple of rallys, and always get the short answer.."Nope, never had that problem"....Still I just ride around with a kinked chain...
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Re: Don't make 'em like they use to
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Joined: May 2010
Posts: 5,720
Check Pants
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Check Pants
Joined: May 2010
Posts: 5,720 |
Quote:
I've replaced the chain on my 2005 about 3 times now, and in under a week, or about 100 miles, the chain "kinks" in several places...Have never been able to understand it. I asked other riders at a couple of rallys, and always get the short answer.."Nope, never had that problem"....Still I just ride around with a kinked chain...
At first I machined some offsets for my straightedge, then I bought one of those $75 laser chain alignment tools, the laser works just as good and fits in the palm of my hand. Eyeballing alignment gets you home, perfection will get you your money s worth. 
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Re: Don't make 'em like they use to
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Joined: Feb 2008
Posts: 2,671 Likes: 15
Loquacious
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Loquacious
Joined: Feb 2008
Posts: 2,671 Likes: 15 |
Quote:
...I bought one of those $75 laser chain alignment tools, the laser works just as good and fits in the palm of my hand...
Couldn't one accomplish pretty much the same thing with a laser bore sighter, or for that matter a laser cat toy, and tape? 
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Re: Don't make 'em like they use to
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Joined: Aug 2008
Posts: 146
Adjunct
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Adjunct
Joined: Aug 2008
Posts: 146 |
I've ruined a few cats making my own laser tool.
Guess I should turn the power down some....
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Re: Don't make 'em like they use to
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Joined: Feb 2007
Posts: 23,243 Likes: 64
Fe Butt
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Fe Butt
Joined: Feb 2007
Posts: 23,243 Likes: 64 |
Quote:
I've ruined a few cats making my own laser tool.
Guess I should turn the power down some....
That's a bonus if you like Chinese food.
I learned all I need to know about life by killing smart people and eating their brains.
Eat right ,Exercise ,Stay fit, Die Anyway!
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Re: Don't make 'em like they use to
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Joined: May 2010
Posts: 5,720
Check Pants
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Check Pants
Joined: May 2010
Posts: 5,720 |
Quote:
Quote:
...I bought one of those $75 laser chain alignment tools, the laser works just as good and fits in the palm of my hand...
Couldn't one accomplish pretty much the same thing with a laser bore sighter, or for that matter a laser cat toy, and tape?
Yes, as long as at least one side of the unit is flat and parallel to the laser beam emitted, ya sure, ya betcha. Results may vary. The purposed laser I have shines along the outboard rivet pin ends the entire length of the chain, when held flat against the rear sprocket with a beam that expands to roughly 3/32nds, + 0, - a 64th, at 42", very easy to read, verify and adjust. But if anybody can make a cat toy or a bore sighter work, it would be you, Ken, carry on.
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Re: Don't make 'em like they use to
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Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 6,681 Likes: 1
Bar Shake
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Bar Shake
Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 6,681 Likes: 1 |
Get a big Thunderbird with a belt and you won't have to worry about all this chain BS.
"Catching a yellow jacket in your shirt at seventy miles per hour can double your vocabulary" Author unknown
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Re: Don't make 'em like they use to
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Joined: May 2010
Posts: 5,720
Check Pants
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Check Pants
Joined: May 2010
Posts: 5,720 |
I live in the land of Glacial Till, one little pebble caught up between the belt and the sprocket and your calling a tow truck..Lots of Harley people have found that out the hard way, around here, anyway.
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Re: Don't make 'em like they use to
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Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 6,681 Likes: 1
Bar Shake
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Bar Shake
Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 6,681 Likes: 1 |
That's true. I'm paranoid on dirt/gravel roads and drive very slow. Because when a belt goes, it's way more expensive than a chain.
"Catching a yellow jacket in your shirt at seventy miles per hour can double your vocabulary" Author unknown
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Re: Don't make 'em like they use to
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Joined: Feb 2007
Posts: 23,243 Likes: 64
Fe Butt
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Fe Butt
Joined: Feb 2007
Posts: 23,243 Likes: 64 |
Much more involved and difficult too.
I learned all I need to know about life by killing smart people and eating their brains.
Eat right ,Exercise ,Stay fit, Die Anyway!
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Re: Don't make 'em like they use to
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Joined: Apr 2008
Posts: 3,937
Loquacious
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OP
Loquacious
Joined: Apr 2008
Posts: 3,937 |
In MY DAY, belts were for putin' stripes on asses! 
And you may see me tonight
With an illegal smile
J. Prine
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Re: Don't make 'em like they use to
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Joined: Jan 2014
Posts: 374
Adjunct
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Adjunct
Joined: Jan 2014
Posts: 374 |
Chains are a PIA, The future belongs to belts on all but the highest performance bikes.
Tin Man 2
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Re: Don't make 'em like they use to
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Joined: May 2010
Posts: 5,720
Check Pants
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Check Pants
Joined: May 2010
Posts: 5,720 |
Quote:
Chains are a PIA, The future belongs to belts on all but the highest performance bikes.
Yes, until you're looking at pulling your swingarm in the middle of no where, when a chain tool and masterlink will get you back in motion. The ratio choices are slim as well. Where I live, every where I go is up the hill/mountain or down, a 18-19/42 final drive ratio equivalent doesn't work for me at all. If I ever move back to Flatbush, I'll reconsider a belt.
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Re: Don't make 'em like they use to
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Joined: Feb 2007
Posts: 23,243 Likes: 64
Fe Butt
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Fe Butt
Joined: Feb 2007
Posts: 23,243 Likes: 64 |
The good Friar tried a belt and after his experience he went back to a chain to stay. I would never run a belt, in the rare event my chain breaks I can fix it in about 10 minutes along the side of the road and ride for the rest of the month, try that with a belt.
I learned all I need to know about life by killing smart people and eating their brains.
Eat right ,Exercise ,Stay fit, Die Anyway!
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