 1200 cc Twin ?
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Was talking with a dealer yesterday, says that the rumors among the Triumph dealers is a 1200 cc Twin. He said if/when you look at the new 2014 Bonnevilles, Speedmasters, and Americas, the engines are wider and the only reason for that(they figure) is for more displacement, and they guess 1200cc. They said they may even have the present displacement as well as the 1200cc. I mentioned that it would fill a hole in the lineup and challenge the T Bird for sales, while gathering more potential customers, he agreed and said they hope that Triumph does it for that reason.
There is a Triumph dealers meeting this weekend, he was hoping they would find out more then.
Our Liberties We Prize and Our Rights We Will Maintain
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Re: 1200 cc Twin ?
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Joined: Jun 2009
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Loquacious
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Loquacious
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I Hope if they do they will fit earlier models Especially a 2007 America! 
Dinosaur.
"Oh Man I only ride 'em.I don't know what makes 'em work". Donald "Oddball" Sutherland
"Don't let the bastards get you down". Kris Kristofferson
"I am only paranoid because everyone is against me". Larry [Frank Burns] Linville
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Re: 1200 cc Twin ?
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Joined: Jun 2009
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Loquacious
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Loquacious
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I forgot to add,I hope they keep it looking like our bikes and not follow the water cooled T-bird style too much.I'll say it again,I LOVE the look of the America/Speedy, but in 1200cc WOW!that'd be Perfect 
Dinosaur.
"Oh Man I only ride 'em.I don't know what makes 'em work". Donald "Oddball" Sutherland
"Don't let the bastards get you down". Kris Kristofferson
"I am only paranoid because everyone is against me". Larry [Frank Burns] Linville
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Re: 1200 cc Twin ?
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Joined: Jan 2005
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Loquacious
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Loquacious
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a 1050 in a speedy would be the cats ass
we should do this every weekend!
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Re: 1200 cc Twin ?
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Joined: Jan 2005
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Saddle Sore
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Saddle Sore
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A 1200 Triumph twin has been on my fantasy list for a long time
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Re: 1200 cc Twin ?
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Joined: Jan 2005
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Should be Riding
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Should be Riding
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Quote:
A 1200 Triumph twin has been on my fantasy list for a long time
Wish they would have done that before the 2008 model year. OR still go back to the wider steering stops, narrower indented tank, spoke wheels, straight shrouds, normal sized tires...jeez how does one spell broken record? 
Blowing gravel off rural roads
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Re: 1200 cc Twin ?
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Joined: Aug 2009
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Learned Hand
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Learned Hand
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Quote:
[...jeez how does one spell broken record?
Old guy who cries for days of yesteryear. 
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Re: 1200 cc Twin ?
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Joined: Feb 2007
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Fe Butt
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Fe Butt
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What changed in the steering stops? I missed that one. I like the fat 16" front wheel but would really like to see the knee indents back and the badge style choices. I also like spoke wheels and would like to see spokes with dual front disc and dual front disc standard on the SM again.
P.S. how about a kick starter too! (and a point conversion kit like HD has)
I learned all I need to know about life by killing smart people and eating their brains.
Eat right ,Exercise ,Stay fit, Die Anyway!
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Re: 1200 cc Twin ?
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Joined: Jan 2008
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Learned Hand
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Learned Hand
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It sounds like the easiest thing to do here would be to just get a 1200 sportster. It is already available to most of the features mentioned in this thread. 
05 speedmaster - 1100cc, 11:1 racing pistons, Carillo rods, thunderbike cams, ported and polished head, 2mm over intake and exhaust valves, Barnett kevlar clutch, scepter pipes, oversize manifolds, 45mm HSR's, TTP stage 4 firestarter
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Re: 1200 cc Twin ?
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Joined: Feb 2007
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Fe Butt
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Fe Butt
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I am happy with my 790 displacement wise but would like a kick start.
I learned all I need to know about life by killing smart people and eating their brains.
Eat right ,Exercise ,Stay fit, Die Anyway!
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Re: 1200 cc Twin ?
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It's about low RPM torque.
The Triumph America/Speedmaster are cruisers, upright riding position feet forward so who wants to push past 100 MPH on this kind of bike...if you do get a Speed Triple it's designed for it.
Harley's engines are built for maximum low RPM torque starting right above idle speed. Such an engine does just fine with pushrods and a 5,500 rpm redline. Since the bulk of their motorcycles (cruisers and touring bikes) weigh 700 to 1000 pounds and many ride with a passenger so building engines that deliver low RPM torque makes sense. If you don't like the vibration even with rubber mounts then get one of the balance shaft Softail models...but all of them sound like a good old big block V8 American muscle car at idle. Not efficient you say? Well at a steady 70 mph the engine is turning 1500 to 2000 less RPM so it's better than you think...and low RPM means less wear.
So there is a case for a larger displacement high torque Triumph cruiser. Triumph had the opportunity with the Rocket-3 but missed the style. It looks like someone bolted a Mini Cooper engine to a motorcycle but at least it has displacement bragging rights.
They had a second chance with the Thunderbird but again missed the style building a bike that looks like a Honda VTX with an engine transplant (no surprise since both bikes were styled by the same person) and went with liquid cooling. What's worse they didn't even try to blend the big ass radiator in it's just stuck out in front of the frame.
The America/Speedmaster have the style. They have reasonable weight and a reliable air cooled Bonneville family twin that looks like a classic Triumph engine should. The 865 has good midrange power 3000-6000 RPM.
Now a 1100-1200cc belting out 50% more torque would be damn near perfect for a cruiser like the America.
2011 Triumph America (10/2011 to 07/2014)
2012 Harley Davidson 1200C Sportster
2014 Harley Davidson Dyna Wide Glide
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Re: 1200 cc Twin ?
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Quote:
I am happy with my 790 displacement wise but would like a kick start.
Kick start would be cool but not sure how hard it would be to design one to work with EFI. And you know some riders would just keep using the kick starter after the battery died...trying to charge a bad battery is very hard on a charging system.
2011 Triumph America (10/2011 to 07/2014)
2012 Harley Davidson 1200C Sportster
2014 Harley Davidson Dyna Wide Glide
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Re: 1200 cc Twin ?
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Joined: Feb 2007
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Fe Butt
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Fe Butt
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I ran my 66 TR6C for more than 10 years with a stone dead battery, I mean it wouldn't even light the brake light right after I shut the bike off and it still started on the first kick.
I learned all I need to know about life by killing smart people and eating their brains.
Eat right ,Exercise ,Stay fit, Die Anyway!
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Re: 1200 cc Twin ?
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Joined: Apr 2007
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Loquacious
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Loquacious
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The new Americas with the 16 inch front wheels have wider triple trees and a wider fork arrangement to fit around the wheel. That's why the quick attachment for the windshield isn't interchangeable between the earlier and newer models.
12 Rocket Roadster
03 Bonneville America
69 BSA Firebird Scrambler
73 Yamaha TX 750
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Re: 1200 cc Twin ?
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TOtally can kick start efi. Is just another way to spin the motor. Royal Enfield does it on efi.
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Re: 1200 cc Twin ?
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Joined: May 2010
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Check Pants
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Check Pants
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Quote:
TOtally can kick start efi. Is just another way to spin the motor. Royal Enfield does it on efi.
Even with a sub par 11 volt battery?
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Re: 1200 cc Twin ?
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Joined: Feb 2007
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Fe Butt
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Fe Butt
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Thanx Greg, figured that was the case.
I learned all I need to know about life by killing smart people and eating their brains.
Eat right ,Exercise ,Stay fit, Die Anyway!
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Re: 1200 cc Twin ?
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Joined: Jan 2005
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Monkey Butt
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Monkey Butt
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Quote:
I am happy with my 790 displacement wise but would like a kick start.
I wouldn't mind having it as long as I don't have to actually USE it! 
We all like to think of ourselves as rugged individualists. But when push comes to shove most of us are sheep who do what we are told. Worst of all, a lot of us become unpaid agents of whoever is controlling the agenda by enforcing the current dogma on the few rugged individualists who actually exist.
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Re: 1200 cc Twin ?
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Joined: Feb 2007
Posts: 23,243 Likes: 64
Fe Butt
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Fe Butt
Joined: Feb 2007
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I learned all I need to know about life by killing smart people and eating their brains.
Eat right ,Exercise ,Stay fit, Die Anyway!
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Re: 1200 cc Twin ?
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Joined: May 2010
Posts: 5,720
Check Pants
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Check Pants
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The motorcycle press would have a hey-day, if Triumph went back to a kick start, but the purists would be partying in the streets..
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Re: 1200 cc Twin ?
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Quote:
Quote:
TOtally can kick start efi. Is just another way to spin the motor. Royal Enfield does it on efi.
Even with a sub par 11 volt battery?
Exactly.
You kick start the bike if the battery dies. If the battery dies the ECU won't power up so you can kick all day and it ain't starting.
2011 Triumph America (10/2011 to 07/2014)
2012 Harley Davidson 1200C Sportster
2014 Harley Davidson Dyna Wide Glide
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Re: 1200 cc Twin ?
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Haha I didn't say it was reliable!
That's the main issue. I would assume If your battery ran down just a bit it would still start it when your starter won't spin. I'd still like one.
And if this mystery engine came out carb (it won't) that'd be even better!
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Re: 1200 cc Twin ?
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Joined: Jan 2005
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Learned Hand
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Learned Hand
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We can kiss CARB days good by thanks to emmisions. Keeping my 05. But so would like to see a 1200. And Im with everyone else Keep it styled just like it is! bring back the indent tanks and badges for sure!
Mal: "Y'all see the man hanging out of the spaceship with the really big gun?{ref, Jayne} Man's lookin' to kill some folk. So really, it's his will y'all should worry about thwarting."
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Re: 1200 cc Twin ?
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Joined: Apr 2008
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3/4 Throttle
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3/4 Throttle
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Ugh, I sold my '68 Bonne 'cause I got tired of kick starting it . . . especially when it kicked back!
I would be unstoppable if not for law enforcement and physics.
2002, Cardinal Red & Silver
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Re: 1200 cc Twin ?
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Joined: Feb 2007
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Fe Butt
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Fe Butt
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The old twins, if tuned right, start on 1 ,maybe 2 or 3 if cold, kicks and I have never had one kick back.
I learned all I need to know about life by killing smart people and eating their brains.
Eat right ,Exercise ,Stay fit, Die Anyway!
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Re: 1200 cc Twin ?
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Joined: Jan 2008
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Learned Hand
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Learned Hand
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It seems to me unlikely that, if the 1200 is a new motor design, that it would be air cooled. With all the emissions regs (and more coming), which motorcycles as a whole have been less afflicted with than cars, liquid cooling offers too much control to not do it. I am sure that air cooled is heading the way of the 2 stroke whether we like it or not.
I do like idea of the kick start on the EFI motor. I have enjoyed watching, half drunk guys trying over and over to bump start their 'custom' baggers with all the ground effects lighting (that has been left on all night). Trying to kick start one, that would be even more entertaining!
05 speedmaster - 1100cc, 11:1 racing pistons, Carillo rods, thunderbike cams, ported and polished head, 2mm over intake and exhaust valves, Barnett kevlar clutch, scepter pipes, oversize manifolds, 45mm HSR's, TTP stage 4 firestarter
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Re: 1200 cc Twin ?
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Joined: Jan 2005
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Bar Shake
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Bar Shake
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Quote:
Ugh, I sold my '68 Bonne 'cause I got tired of kick starting it . . . especially when it kicked back!
Electricity is a wonderful thing 
Contra todo mal, mezcal; contra todo bien, también
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Re: 1200 cc Twin ?
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Joined: Nov 2011
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Quote:
Ugh, I sold my '68 Bonne 'cause I got tired of kick starting it . . . especially when it kicked back!
And a modern version of that is what broke a few of the early 790cc cases I believe.
2011 Triumph America (10/2011 to 07/2014)
2012 Harley Davidson 1200C Sportster
2014 Harley Davidson Dyna Wide Glide
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Re: 1200 cc Twin ?
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Joined: Nov 2011
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Quote:
It seems to me unlikely that, if the 1200 is a new motor design, that it would be air cooled. With all the emissions regs (and more coming), which motorcycles as a whole have been less afflicted with than cars, liquid cooling offers too much control to not do it. I am sure that air cooled is heading the way of the 2 stroke whether we like it or not.
I do like idea of the kick start on the EFI motor. I have enjoyed watching, half drunk guys trying over and over to bump start their 'custom' baggers with all the ground effects lighting (that has been left on all night). Trying to kick start one, that would be even more entertaining!
Well the all new and quite powerful Indian Thunder Stroke V-Twin is air cooled.
2011 Triumph America (10/2011 to 07/2014)
2012 Harley Davidson 1200C Sportster
2014 Harley Davidson Dyna Wide Glide
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Re: 1200 cc Twin ?
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Joined: Apr 2008
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3/4 Throttle
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3/4 Throttle
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Quote:
The old twins, if tuned right, start on 1 ,maybe 2 or 3 if cold, kicks and I have never had one kick back.
I'm not the greatest mechanic, and the ones in my area of Kentucky when I moved there were worse than that! 
I would be unstoppable if not for law enforcement and physics.
2002, Cardinal Red & Silver
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Re: 1200 cc Twin ?
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Joined: Jan 2005
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Loquacious
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Loquacious
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Quote:
It seems to me unlikely that, if the 1200 is a new motor design, that it would be air cooled.
In my thread about this bike/engine from a few weeks ago I mentioned I asked "deep throat" three times about whether the engine would be air-cooled (yes ... it is) just to make sure I heard him right.
The planned bike will be a bobber/streetfighter styled machine coming out in the fall of 2015 as a 2016 model.
Still want a 1000cc plus! air-cooled Triumph Twin?
Bedouin.
Blessed are those eyes that have seen more roads than any man! (Homer).
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Re: 1200 cc Twin ?
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Joined: Feb 2005
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Fe Butt
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Fe Butt
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Quote:
The planned bike will be a bobber/streetfighter styled machine coming out in the fall of 2015 as a 2016 model.
UNLESS of course your name happens to be "Grzegorz" and you live on and register your new 2016 1200cc air-cooled Triumph Twin on that little island situated off the coast of continental Europe known as "Britain", and where they still use the superfluous letter 'u' to spell certain words.
And THEN of course your new motorcycle would STILL be a "2015" model!
(...sorry, I JUST couldn't resist!) 
Yep! Just like a good Single Malt Scotch, you might call me "an acquired taste" TOO.(among the many OTHER things you may care to call me, of course)
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Re: 1200 cc Twin ?
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Joined: Jan 2007
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Loquacious
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Loquacious
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I wonder if they'll keep both the America and SpeedMaster after adding this new model. Seems like the Speedy might be too close.
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Re: 1200 cc Twin ?
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Joined: Feb 2005
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Fe Butt
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Fe Butt
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Interesting question here, Steve.
The boys in Hinckley might just conclude there would be a little redundancy in their line-up with the advent of this new model and decide to do something like that, especially considering that the Speedmasters have recently become somewhat of a Bobber version of the Americas.
Yep! Just like a good Single Malt Scotch, you might call me "an acquired taste" TOO.(among the many OTHER things you may care to call me, of course)
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Re: 1200 cc Twin ?
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Call the new 1200 a Speedmaster!!
05 Speedmaster,Reverse Cone Shortys,Thunderbike AIR Kit,K&N Air Filter,Snorkel Removed,Dynojet Stage 1 Kit(126 main),Needle-Clip 1 From Bottom,42 Pilot,NGK Iridium Plugs,Progressive Springs,Hagon 2810's,Barnett Green Springs,TTP Safe-Start,MOSFET R/R
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Re: 1200 cc Twin ?
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Joined: Feb 2007
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Fe Butt
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Fe Butt
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The SM also lost things like the dual disc that made it different.
I learned all I need to know about life by killing smart people and eating their brains.
Eat right ,Exercise ,Stay fit, Die Anyway!
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Re: 1200 cc Twin ?
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Joined: Nov 2011
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Quote:
The SM also lost things like the dual disc that made it different.
Probably because the new skinny front tire would lock up with a single disc, duals would be a waste. Tire traction is the limit, even the sporty Thruxton has a single disc.
2011 Triumph America (10/2011 to 07/2014)
2012 Harley Davidson 1200C Sportster
2014 Harley Davidson Dyna Wide Glide
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Re: 1200 cc Twin ?
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Joined: Feb 2007
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Fe Butt
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Fe Butt
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True but not a valid argument since the single disc would lock the old tire too. I think it is more about keeping them cool.
I learned all I need to know about life by killing smart people and eating their brains.
Eat right ,Exercise ,Stay fit, Die Anyway!
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Re: 1200 cc Twin ?
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Joined: Nov 2011
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Quote:
True but not a valid argument since the single disc would lock the old tire too. I think it is more about keeping them cool.
Maybe they just went cheap and saved the money.
2011 Triumph America (10/2011 to 07/2014)
2012 Harley Davidson 1200C Sportster
2014 Harley Davidson Dyna Wide Glide
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Re: 1200 cc Twin ?
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Joined: Feb 2005
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Fe Butt
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Fe Butt
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Quote:
Quote:
True but not a valid argument since the single disc would lock the old tire too. I think it is more about keeping them cool.
Maybe they just went cheap and saved the money.
BINGO! Remember, Triumph's air-cooled Twins have always been "built to a cost". Why else would they have also bolted the cheapest shocks they could source onto these models all these years?!
Yep! Just like a good Single Malt Scotch, you might call me "an acquired taste" TOO.(among the many OTHER things you may care to call me, of course)
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