 Re: Carbs backfiring and hesitation
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Joined: Jul 2012
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Uh yeah,
Old owner bought the triumph here NEW.
These have had cracks in them for years... Both of them. Why would they not change them? Answer: Not in stock.
I called to buy what I thought would be a stock part on Sat thinking I could just leisurely run in and pick them up.
How could that NOT be a stock part I scoffed. And of course I was told they would have to be ordered.
SO, I said if I wanted to order them, "I could do that from 20 different websites". I could tell the parts guy was annoyed by that. I said if you had the part stocked I would pick them up right now. But no such luck.
wouldn't you think that would be a stock part?
Regardless, the parts are ordered. The carbs are back together and waiting for the rubbers.
Last edited by goregalore; 08/05/2012 10:19 AM.
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Re: Carbs backfiring and hesitation
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Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 11,126 Likes: 13
Should be Riding
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Should be Riding
Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 11,126 Likes: 13 |
How long did they tell you you'll have to wait? I've got two sets of rubbers, one of which I could send you. (I replaced the original rubbers with oem ones before the original ones went bad.) Hum, you might want to order some aftermarket clamps for those rubbers. The oem clamps fail to tighten up sufficiently over time.
Blowing gravel off rural roads
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Re: Carbs backfiring and hesitation
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Joined: Jul 2012
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We didn't really get to that. I ordered them from www.madss.comThey said 5 to 6 days. I know these clamps are stainless and they are more narrow than standard worm clamps so I bet you they are the marine ones. Thank you Moe, that is VERY generous of you. I think I will be ok unless they ordered the wrong parts;)
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Re: Carbs backfiring and hesitation
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Joined: Jul 2012
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I just purchased both a oil temp gauge and an oil pressure gauge.
But I can't seem to find what the running oil temp and the running oil pressure should be.
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Re: Carbs backfiring and hesitation
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Joined: Feb 2007
Posts: 23,197 Likes: 56
Fe Butt
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Fe Butt
Joined: Feb 2007
Posts: 23,197 Likes: 56 |
about 20 to 40 psi at idle depending on temp and about 80psi running and my bike runs around 190ºF more or l;ess depending on ambient temp. I made our oil pressure gauges for about $50 each if I remember right.   
I learned all I need to know about life by killing smart people and eating their brains.
Eat right ,Exercise ,Stay fit, Die Anyway!
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Re: Carbs backfiring and hesitation
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Joined: Jul 2012
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Super sweet!
thanks for such a fast response.
I have oil pressure on all my vehicles.
It helps prevent major damage.
This is my first oil temp and I bet it is an even faster indicator that something is about to go wrong, which should help prevent a real problem.
Every bike should have both on them.
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Re: Carbs backfiring and hesitation
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Joined: Mar 2008
Posts: 1,586 Likes: 1
Learned Hand
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Learned Hand
Joined: Mar 2008
Posts: 1,586 Likes: 1 |
Quote:
Quote:
Not sure what altitude you live at but I bet you should have about a 150 to 155 main unless you have baffles in those Sceptres.
I'm not sure the original Septres have baffles, mine don't.
Mine did.
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Re: Carbs backfiring and hesitation
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Joined: Jul 2012
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Parts arrived today.
So, carb rubbers have been installed. With wide portion of divider facing up and with the rubber tab facing the heads.
The bike started right up with the choke and not using the throttle at all. After it warmed up with would idle just fine.
But as soon as I tried to use the throttle it would just die.
I tried adjusting the pilot screws up in both directions and it made no difference except the exhaust started getting a whump whump sound to it.
Not sure if I should try what Robert had to do which was reverse the carb rubbers.
I don't quite understand why that worked for him.
I thought the next step was to again check the plugs to see if they went from lean to rich and if so put the 45 pilot jet in.
I am again open to input here.
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Re: Carbs backfiring and hesitation
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Joined: Feb 2008
Posts: 2,671 Likes: 15
Loquacious
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Loquacious
Joined: Feb 2008
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Are you sure that the carb boots are properly seated to the head & the carbs are properly seated in the boots? The tabs are supposed to face the head for a reason, I would not reverse them.
Did you check the vacuum piston rubbers (a/k/a slide diaphrams) for tears/cracks, & make sure they are seated properly?
42 pilots are on the small side for a bike with your mods and NBAD needles; I suggest that you make sure the slide rubbers are properly seated in the groove, & if so, then try two .5mm shims (1mm total) under each needle head & see if the situation improves.
Also, with the bike upright, run some clear plastic tubing from the carb bowl drain vertically up the side of the carb body, open the bowl drain screw a bit, & see where the fuel level is in the tube (with the fuel valve on or reserve, of course), relative to the bowl gasket...where exactly is each one?
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Re: Carbs backfiring and hesitation
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Joined: Jul 2012
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The nice thing is the heads have stops on them so you know when the rubbers are seated properly, And I just made sure the carbs were in the rubbers as far as I could get them until they almost hit the vacuum plugs.
Now, I know there are 4 vacuum rubbers on the carbs. ALL of them have been replaced. I will try to locate more rubbers and see if they are ok.
I will try to work with the bike this weekend.
And I do have shims to try.
I also know a 42 pilot was a little small.
But the shims is an easy trouble shoot to try first.
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Re: Carbs backfiring and hesitation
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Joined: May 2007
Posts: 6,432 Likes: 1
Worn Saddle
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Worn Saddle
Joined: May 2007
Posts: 6,432 Likes: 1 |
If you pull the tops plan some time to let the diaphragms dry, they'll have absorbed some fuel and expanded where they won't fit back in the groove. About an hour should be fine.
A positive attitude may not solve all your problems, but it will annoy enough people to make it worth the effort. Herm Albright (1876 - 1944)
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Re: Carbs backfiring and hesitation
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Joined: Jul 2011
Posts: 2,212
Oil Expert
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Oil Expert
Joined: Jul 2011
Posts: 2,212 |
well that made little sense, ran with the ripped boots, poorley at times but ran, now with the new ones runs worse? something wrong with the install of those boots.
Make sure you did not put a hole in your pods when you were re-installing everything.
Last edited by edmspeedmaster; 08/15/2012 11:47 AM.
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Re: Carbs backfiring and hesitation
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Joined: Apr 2007
Posts: 3,063 Likes: 8
Loquacious
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Loquacious
Joined: Apr 2007
Posts: 3,063 Likes: 8 |
Quote:
I tried adjusting the pilot screws up in both directions and it made no difference except the exhaust started getting a whump whump sound to it.
Adjusting the pilot screws up leans the mixture. Is that what you were trying to achieve? Even at 3.75 turns the bike should run and idle (maybe a little rough). The bike should have ran fine with the new boots set up the way it is.
Quote:
I thought the next step was to again check the plugs to see if they went from lean to rich and if so put the 45 pilot jet in.
I am again open to input here.
If the plugs went from lean to rich....going from 42 to 45 pilots will richen things up again???
Something happened when you opened up your carbs. Now you have to find it. I wouldn't change anything in terms of needles, shims or pilots because the bike ran well before the boots were cracked. As stated, check the float heights (might have been messed up when carbs opened), needles back in place properly, diaphragm rubbers in place properly and not pinched, and anything else that might have been touched when the carbs were opened.
12 Rocket Roadster
03 Bonneville America
69 BSA Firebird Scrambler
73 Yamaha TX 750
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Re: Carbs backfiring and hesitation
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Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 6,308 Likes: 4
Worn Saddle
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Worn Saddle
Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 6,308 Likes: 4 |
Quote:
Kevin, doesn't that take the cake? Really. "Please de-varnish my carburetors mr stealership" Okay oldcustomerwhomweusedtolovenowwewillripyouoff. Big4Cycle, Way to go. Brilliant attention to detail. Marvelous work. Exceptional diligence.
R U KIDDING? Pull the carbs and not see the rubbers as bad?
grrr ?
A word to the wise is not necessary. It is the stupid ones who need the advice.
Pat
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Re: Carbs backfiring and hesitation
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Joined: Jul 2012
Posts: 103
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OP
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Well,
I know the rubbers are on correctly.
Moe reminded me to check the vent on the tank. I might have pinched it.
The bike went from lean to rich.
That is expected.
On the pilots, I adjusted it down first to see if I could lean them out and then back up to 3 turns out since it didn't seem to make any difference.
I still have a feeling that the carbs aren't quite clean. I bet there is a passage blocked. But I will reserve that judgement until I can't get this troubleshooting to work.
This bike ran previously with the way it is set up before it sat for a couple years and then the carbs got lacquered up. So I know it should not need shims, or jet changes.
But I am going to try both electrical connection checks and the potential vacuum issues first.
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Re: Carbs backfiring and hesitation
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Joined: Jul 2012
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I checked the tank vent. No on that I looked over the electrical and checked the coils. They don't seem to be getting the best contact. It started raining so I didn't get to clean and tighten the battery terminals. I also opened up the carb tops, and the rubber is seated properly. I pulled the plugs and verified that it is running rich now from changing out the carb rubbers. That is the ONLY change I made to the bike. http://sphotos-b.xx.fbcdn.net/hphotos-ash4/253875_3760661415023_1793590280_n.jpg
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Re: Carbs backfiring and hesitation
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Joined: Feb 2007
Posts: 23,197 Likes: 56
Fe Butt
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Fe Butt
Joined: Feb 2007
Posts: 23,197 Likes: 56 |
when checking the tank vent did you also check the tip over valve?
I learned all I need to know about life by killing smart people and eating their brains.
Eat right ,Exercise ,Stay fit, Die Anyway!
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Re: Carbs backfiring and hesitation
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Joined: Jul 2012
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Totally had a "DUH" light bulb moment tonight.
I know what is wrong.
I can't believe I did it.
I assembled the top end of the carbs in the wrong order.
I put the needle guide in and then dropped the needle in.
SO, I will fix it in about 10 minutes tonight.
And here I am saying how much simpler the triumph carbs are than Honda carbs and look what I do.
Jeeeze!
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Re: Carbs backfiring and hesitation
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Joined: Feb 2008
Posts: 2,671 Likes: 15
Loquacious
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Loquacious
Joined: Feb 2008
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Guess you don't need the shims yet... 
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Re: Carbs backfiring and hesitation
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Nope,
No need for shims;)
After figuring out what I did, I had it running in no more than 10 minutes. The af was set at 3 turns out and I could smell it was running a little rich, so adjusted back to 2.5 turns out. Less rich, and then took it for a 10 mile ride.
Need to check the spark plugs to see if they are in the normal range or still running rich.
Is so then need to change out the 42 for a 45 pilot to remedy the rich mix.
But hoping I don't need to do that. But I have a NEW sound to the exhaust with the lowered af mixture setting.
But it runs great. No flat spots.
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Brake rotor issues
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Something that is looking to be an issue.
The back brake rotor doesn't look so good. It is grooved, a little rusty from sitting. And what is getting my attention is delaminating in a few spots. And a bit noisy on braking.
Can I sand the rotor or do I just need to change it out.
I need new tires so it would be great to do this at the same time if needed.
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Re: Carbs backfiring and hesitation
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This speedmaster on ebay says it has Dunlop 404 whitewalls. But no front fender. This is the look I am going for. Are the 404s a good fit? http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/Triumph-B...2#ht_954wt_1165
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Re: Carbs backfiring and hesitation
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Joined: Apr 2007
Posts: 3,063 Likes: 8
Loquacious
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Loquacious
Joined: Apr 2007
Posts: 3,063 Likes: 8 |
Quote:
Need to check the spark plugs to see if they are in the normal range or still running rich.
Is so then need to change out the 42 for a 45 pilot to remedy the rich mix.
Once again, going from 42 to 45 pilots won't lean things out but richen it. Larger pilot jet numbers means richer settings. Going to a 45 pilot will richen things more.
12 Rocket Roadster
03 Bonneville America
69 BSA Firebird Scrambler
73 Yamaha TX 750
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Re: Carbs backfiring and hesitation
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Joined: Feb 2008
Posts: 2,671 Likes: 15
Loquacious
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Loquacious
Joined: Feb 2008
Posts: 2,671 Likes: 15 |
If it is running OK with the 42's, unless you have access to an air fuel meter then IMO leave it alone.
That said, you might want to lean-out the pilot screws by an eight to a quarter of a turn (turn them clockwise "in" to make leaner) at a time & retest each time; provided you don't get lean-surging at cruise or hesitation on acceleration, then fuel economy should improve. If you keep going until you encounter either lean-surging or hesitation, then you'll know where the lean limit is.
Keep in mind that the fuel mixture will automatically lean out in colder weather, all other things equal.
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Re: Brake rotor issues
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Joined: Feb 2008
Posts: 2,671 Likes: 15
Loquacious
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Loquacious
Joined: Feb 2008
Posts: 2,671 Likes: 15 |
Quote:
Something that is looking to be an issue.
The back brake rotor doesn't look so good. It is grooved, a little rusty from sitting. And what is getting my attention is delaminating in a few spots. And a bit noisy on braking.
Can I sand the rotor or do I just need to change it out.
I need new tires so it would be great to do this at the same time if needed.
I suggest measuring the rotor width to dertermine if it is still within spec; what is the remaining brake pad thickness? Without knowing that, it's hard to say.
You can clean up the "rust" with some steel wool & brake cleaner.
Given that this started as a carb thread & has now morphed into brakes you might want to start another thread focused on brakes.
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Re: Carbs backfiring and hesitation
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Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 10,721 Likes: 5
Should be Riding
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Should be Riding
Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 10,721 Likes: 5 |
Quote:
This speedmaster on ebay says it has Dunlop 404 whitewalls. But no front fender. This is the look I am going for. Are the 404s a good fit?
http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/Triumph-B...2#ht_954wt_1165
except for the pipes (and the sticker on the custom battery cover?) that looks just like Mikey790's bike...
Always remember to be yourself. Unless you suck. Then pretend to be someone else.
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Re: Carbs backfiring and hesitation
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Joined: Jul 2012
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Brakes,
there is next to NO pad on the back brakes.
Front looks ok.
On the carbs.
I leaned them out some but then when it came to starting.
I am having difficulty again.
When the needles were being held by the guides it started like a champ.
Now, lots of trouble.
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Re: Carbs backfiring and hesitation
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Joined: Feb 2008
Posts: 2,671 Likes: 15
Loquacious
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Loquacious
Joined: Feb 2008
Posts: 2,671 Likes: 15 |
Quote:
Brakes,
there is next to NO pad on the back brakes.
Front looks ok.
On the carbs.
I leaned them out some but then when it came to starting.
I am having difficulty again.
When the needles were being held by the guides it started like a champ.
Now, lots of trouble.
Carbs: gotta give us more detail to go on...your bike is now hard-starting with the enrichener (a/k/a "choke") full on (pulled out all the way)?
Brakes: replace the rear pads!
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Re: Carbs backfiring and hesitation
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Joined: Jul 2012
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choke full on no start
half choke no start
no choke no start
It took a good 5 minutes to get the bike started this morning after correcting the carbs yesterday.
I ordered white wall tires this morning and brake pads for front and back organic ebc pads through motorcycle superstore. I only bring it up because they do not list the part #, but you select the bike model.
And sent cad specs to my laser cutter for fender brackets to add the wider and taller front tires
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Re: Carbs backfiring and hesitation
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Joined: Feb 2008
Posts: 2,671 Likes: 15
Loquacious
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Loquacious
Joined: Feb 2008
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Prsuming there is nothing else funky with the carbs (such as failed enrichener, which is possible) then perhaps your "new" issue is electrical...
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Re: Carbs backfiring and hesitation
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I am planning on taking a harder look at that option. I tried to tighten up the coil connections, but still feel they could be tighter. And still planning on pulling the battery cable and checking those connections, cleaning etc...
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