 Re: Bin Laden is Dead?
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Joined: Dec 2006
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New Tires
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New Tires
Joined: Dec 2006
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And Tom Donilon works for who? He obviously is over paid and needs to do his homework.
Every normal man must be tempted, at times, to spit on his hands, hoist the black flag, and begin slitting throats.
H. L. Mencken
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Re: Bin Laden is Dead?
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Joined: Jan 2010
Posts: 896
phoenix
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phoenix
Joined: Jan 2010
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Like it or not, waterboarding works!
Congratulation to ALL those involved in this successful operation.
Water boarding has my vote, maybe it will stop 3000 more people from dieing. And if they need a team leader[waterboarding] i'm avalable!
I mean if a guy carries explosives on airplane, in his shoe.And in his shorts.If it saves one american life waterboarding is a winner.
Now watch all the bleeding hearts , tell you we didn't get bin laden this way. 
Btw way did anybody think as i did?.No filthy rich millionare is gonna live in a dirt cave. right!!
Now all the details of this incedent, will be thourghly picked apart by the media, " hooray bin laden is dead hooray!! and leave it at that, now go after the rest of his, bosum buddies,
Last edited by bsa_bob; 05/03/2011 7:24 PM.
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Re: Bin Laden is Dead?
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Joined: Feb 2011
Posts: 2,146
Oil Expert
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Oil Expert
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Being the NSA he would have been the person primarily responsible for putting the pieces together to find Bin Laden and, presumably, was involved in planning the raid. So 'homework' regarding this subject would consist of talking to Tom Donilon, as he would know more on the subject than anyone.
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Re: Bin Laden is Dead?
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Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 18,825
"Lighten up, Francis."
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"Lighten up, Francis."
Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 18,825 |
Found online and posted to Facebook:
Business Insider: "The military team that killed Osama Bin Laden is an elite special forces group unofficially called Seal Team 6. Officially, the team's name is classified and not available to the public, technically there is no team 6."
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Re: Bin Laden is Dead?
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Joined: Feb 2006
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Loquacious
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Loquacious
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Water Booarding? I watched a little of "The Falcon and the
Snowman" last night. They were using a technique I'd have
to call toilet bowling. Sean Penn was inverted, and having
his head dunked in a toilet, over and over. Looked effective.
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Re: Bin Laden is Dead?
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Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 18,825
"Lighten up, Francis."
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"Lighten up, Francis."
Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 18,825 |
I'm all for torture just for torture's sake, but those on this forum who are claiming it was used to get this done really have no idea if it was involved or not. By all official accounts (discount them if you will but they're readily available) say they tracked a courier to find him, then noticed some rather curious things about the place that courier went (no wired communications in or out, abnormal burning trash, etc.) then they observed that location for months.
So STFU if you don't know what you're talking about.
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Re: Bin Laden is Dead?
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Joined: Feb 2011
Posts: 2,146
Oil Expert
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Oil Expert
Joined: Feb 2011
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Quote:
Found online and posted to Facebook:
Business Insider: "The military team that killed Osama Bin Laden is an elite special forces group unofficially called Seal Team 6. Officially, the team's name is classified and not available to the public, technically there is no team 6."
There's nothing classified about the existence of SEAL teams. I served at two navy bases that had SEAL teams. Their individual names might be classified, I never looked, but their duty officer's office number was in the daily log. My sister was a supply officer for them. For goodness sake, they have their own uniform insignia and wear it proudly.
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Re: Bin Laden is Dead?
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Joined: Jan 2007
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Loquacious
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Loquacious
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We'll never know whether torture was used or not and we have no real "need to know". But now the political games begin. The right will say that the policies of the previous administration finally bore fruit and the left will claim it was all done by their guy and his "kinder, gentler" interrogation techniques. But we'll never really know, will we? I do believe what I've read that the intelligence agencies have had this courier's name for years and were slowly and methodically tracking him. That gives credit to both administrations - regardless of their interrogation methods of choice.
Bottom line; it's over and time to give credit where credit is due and move on. Lets get back to fixing our economy and take this off the front page. Time again to marginalize the fear of terrorism or we've just fallen into their trap once more.
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Re: Bin Laden is Dead?
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Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 20,096 Likes: 2
Fe Butt
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Fe Butt
Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 20,096 Likes: 2 |
Quote:
I'm all for torture just for torture's sake, but those on this forum who are claiming it was used to get this done really have no idea if it was involved or not. By all official accounts (discount them if you will but they're readily available) say they tracked a courier to find him, then noticed some rather curious things about the place that courier went (no wired communications in or out, abnormal burning trash, etc.) then they observed that location for months.
So STFU if you don't know what you're talking about.
Excellent point, John! 
And speakin' o' which, and reflectoring...err...I mean REFLECTING back  on what Bob said above....
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I mean if a guy carries explosives on airplane, in his shoe.And in his shorts.If it saves one american life waterboarding is a winner.
...Bob ol' buddy, I'd like to remind you that the capture of Richard Reid, aka "The Shoe Bomber", nor Umar Farouk Abdulmutallab, aka "The Underwear Bomber", was facilitated by the use of any "Enhanced Interrogation" methods.....period. That they were able to board a plane with undetected explosive devices was purely a failure of our airport security measures. AND, that either one of these lone perpetrators and/or a member of an EXTREMELY small terrorist cell could have been detected beforehand by our Intelligence gathering institutions, and thus beforehand the information could have been gleaned by ANY interrogation methods, is such a remote possibility that it boarders, if not smack dab, on being moot.
(...but then again, you know us "Bleeding Hearts" out here...we're likely to throw ANY FACTS out there to prove our point, huh?!) 
Yep! Just like a good Single Malt Scotch, you might call me "an acquired taste" TOO.(among the many OTHER things you may care to call me, of course)
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Re: Bin Laden is Dead?
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Joined: Feb 2006
Posts: 3,099
Loquacious
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Loquacious
Joined: Feb 2006
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I heard he was shot above the left eye, and in the chest.
Should have read: shot between the eyes, and straight
through the heart. Well, at least we got him. 10 years.
Well done to the Navy Seals, and to all our Armed Forces.
Can we bring them home yet?
Uncle Charlie
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Re: Bin Laden is Dead?
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Joined: Feb 2011
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Oil Expert
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Oil Expert
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Here's an example of how not classified their existence is. This is a list of the commanding officers of SEAL Team Six readily available online.
Commander Richard Marcinko – Nov 1980 to July 1983
Captain Robert A. Gormly – 1983 to 1986
Captain Thomas E. Murphy – 1986 to 1987
Captain Richard T.P. Woolard – 1987 to 1990
Captain Ronald E. Yeaw – 1990 to 1992
Captain Thomas G. Moser – 1992 to 1994
Admiral Eric T. Olson – 1994 to 1997
Vice Admiral Albert M. Calland III – June 1997 to June 1999
Vice Admiral Joseph D. Kernan – 1999 to 2002
Rear Admiral Edward G. Winters, III – 2002 to 2004
Captain Eric Prescott
Rear Admiral Brian L. Losey
Rear Admiral Scott P. Moore
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Re: Bin Laden is Dead?
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Joined: Feb 2006
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Loquacious
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Loquacious
Joined: Feb 2006
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I can go on Google Earth(or whatever) and see a satelite
picture of my pickup truck parked in my mom's driveway,
or my boats at the marina. And nobody noticed OBL was in
a compound surrounded by barbed wire in an up-scale hood
for 6 years??? Boy, have we been had.
We give untold billions every year around the globe to
people who hate us, and want to kill us.
What's wrong with this picture?
I can't be the only one who feels this way.
Uncle Charlie
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Re: Bin Laden is Dead?
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Joined: Sep 2010
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Second Wind
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Second Wind
Joined: Sep 2010
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Quote:
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Still most people won't care. Only the conspiracy nutjobs and anyone running against Obama in the next election. But the latter will have to tread lightly on this topic.
Yeah John, and apparently it's already started, too!
It seems they found Osama bin Laden's birth certificate(speakin' o' "birth certificates"), and it turns out bin Laden was born in Cairo!
Nope! Not Cairo Egypt...Cairo ILLINOIS!!!!
(...and I THINK you can figure out what they're gonna do with that whole "Illinois connection" that the guy shared with a certain ex-"community activist" from Chicago...RIGHT?!)
It'll be hard to say they were anykind of buddies. Obama did give the order to shoot the guy. Besides don't forget the theory that the Binladins and Bush the latter were buddies. That would mean the Bush family and the Obamas would also be buddies at least by proxy. Neither side want that association made.
Ya know Chad, FIRST it was your lack of acknowledging my friggin' "MATCH GAME" joke, and NOW, with your apparent DISregard of my latest "Cairo" one...well...If THIS keeps UP, I'm gonna have to put you on my LIST!!!
"WHAT list?", you ask?! My list of folks around who won't PLAY ALONG with my lousy friggin' comedy routines at BA.com!!!!!
(...and DON'T get any "ideas" out there all you OTHER folks around here who occasionally slip into my little "trap" and unwittingly find yourselves playing along and who NOW might think you might've found your permanent escape strategy from that!!!...YOU'RE STUCK!!!!!)
I promise I didnt ignore the reference. You know I love to play your games with ya. Anything that helps me to laugh while I am at work is sweet sweet relief. Its hard to play in from a blackberry with its tiny tiny screen.
I guess if they were neighbors he should have studied up on Chicago "gangster" politics. They will shoot you to get a head. Case in point: Look back at Anton Cermak, the Chicago politician killed by a bullet meant for President Roosevelt in 1933.
http://www.legacy.com/ns/news-story.aspx?t=antonin-cermak--father-of-the-chicago-machine&id=250
I have no faith in human perfectability. I think that human exertion will have no appreciable effect upon humanity. Man is now only more active - not more happy - nor more wise, than he was 6000 years ago.
Edgar Allan Poe
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Re: Bin Laden is Dead?
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Loquacious
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Loquacious
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After being fed a heaping helping of The Single Bullet Theory & The Warren Report back when, (not to mention the FBI has still not opened the JFK files) and considering what is nowadays called "news," I am at best cynical. The immediate & not in accordance with Islamic burial spin doctor baloney is a might curious too. Y'spose this was all a plot to get the Royals off the telly? 
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Re: Bin Laden is Dead?
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Loquacious
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Loquacious
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Things are starting to get fishy alright.
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Re: Bin Laden is Dead?
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Loquacious
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Loquacious
Joined: May 2006
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Don't get me wrong - I hope they got him. It's just that the laundry list of BS we've been fed in the past gets in my way of immediate acceptance.
The Gulf of Tonkin, WMDs, the heavily parsed and censored school days history teachings of my white middle class upbringing, & so on and so forth...
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Re: Bin Laden is Dead?
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Joined: Feb 2006
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Loquacious
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Loquacious
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If the only part of it that's true is that the target
was aquired, that's good enough for me. I don't care
who signed off on it.
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Re: Bin Laden is Dead?
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Joined: Feb 2007
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Fe Butt
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Fe Butt
Joined: Feb 2007
Posts: 23,194 Likes: 56 |
Quote:
If the only part of it that's true is that the target
was aquired, that's good enough for me. I don't care
who signed off on it.
+1
I learned all I need to know about life by killing smart people and eating their brains.
Eat right ,Exercise ,Stay fit, Die Anyway!
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Re: Bin Laden is Dead?
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Joined: Feb 2011
Posts: 2,146
Oil Expert
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Oil Expert
Joined: Feb 2011
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Quote:
Don't get me wrong - I hope they got him. It's just that the laundry list of BS we've been fed in the past gets in my way of immediate acceptance.
The Gulf of Tonkin, WMDs, the heavily parsed and censored school days history teachings of my white middle class upbringing, & so on and so forth...
I recently read about a new history book the Texas Board of Education has adopted. Among other tasty items the book states that Sen. Joseph McCarthy was censured by the Senate but "he was later exonerated"?
WTF? Does anybody ever recall McCarthy ever being "exonerated"?
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Re: Bin Laden is Dead?
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Joined: Feb 2006
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Loquacious
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Loquacious
Joined: Feb 2006
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Re: Bin Laden is Dead?
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Joined: Feb 2005
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Fe Butt
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Fe Butt
Joined: Feb 2005
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Quote:
After being fed a heaping helping of The Single Bullet Theory & The Warren Report back when, (not to mention the FBI has still not opened the JFK files) and considering what is nowadays called "news," I am at best cynical.
I'm just gonna say this flat out, Martin....
John Fitzgerald Kennedy was assassinated by a LONE gunman by the name of Lee Harvey Oswald...who was SUCH a friggin' loser in life, but who couldn't accept that fact about himself, AND who was sooooooo desperate for ANY kind of notoriety, that he ventured into a book depository with an Italian-made 6.5 mm Carcano-type Model 91/38 rifle, one Dallas Texas November day in 1963....PERIOD!!!
And, I say "PERIOD" there because every single conspiracy theory that has EVER come down the pike, could and HAS eventually had sooooooo many holes shot through 'em that one could ALMOST "believe" Lee Harvey Oswald himself, a U.S. Marine "Sharpshooter", could have fired those friggin' holes into 'em!
(...and now, does anybody wanna talk about Roswell NM???...IT WAS A FRIGGIN' WEATHER BALLOON MADE OF MYLAR!!!!) 
Yep! Just like a good Single Malt Scotch, you might call me "an acquired taste" TOO.(among the many OTHER things you may care to call me, of course)
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Re: Bin Laden is Dead?
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Joined: Feb 2007
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Fe Butt
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Fe Butt
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Personally, that final head shot sure looks like it comes from the front.
I learned all I need to know about life by killing smart people and eating their brains.
Eat right ,Exercise ,Stay fit, Die Anyway!
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Re: Bin Laden is Dead?
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Joined: Feb 2005
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Fe Butt
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Fe Butt
Joined: Feb 2005
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Quote:
Personally, that final head shot sure looks like it comes from the front.
Watch a certain 2hr History Channel piece titled "Who Really Killed J.F.K." which is occasionally re-broadcast, and then decide for yourself, Ian.
(...that sucker was EXCELLENTLY laid out, and I think pretty much puts those "holes" I mentioned above in every conspiracy theory that's ever arisen about that dark day in our history)
Yep! Just like a good Single Malt Scotch, you might call me "an acquired taste" TOO.(among the many OTHER things you may care to call me, of course)
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Re: Bin Laden is Dead?
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Joined: Feb 2007
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Fe Butt
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Fe Butt
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I have seen that show and that final shot still looks to me like it comes from the front. The way the pieces fly and the way his head moves sure looks like a frontal impact to me.
I learned all I need to know about life by killing smart people and eating their brains.
Eat right ,Exercise ,Stay fit, Die Anyway!
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Re: Bin Laden is Dead?
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Joined: Sep 2010
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Second Wind
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Second Wind
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You would be surprised how fast a bolt action rifle can be fired. (Just venture into the woods during deer season any where south of the mason dixon) As far as the alien thing Roswell. I think Jack Nicholson's character in Easyrider said it best. About 2.5 minutes in. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=73PnAymHAHk
I have no faith in human perfectability. I think that human exertion will have no appreciable effect upon humanity. Man is now only more active - not more happy - nor more wise, than he was 6000 years ago.
Edgar Allan Poe
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Re: Bin Laden is Dead?
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Joined: Feb 2007
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Fe Butt
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Fe Butt
Joined: Feb 2007
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I grew up with firearms among some was the complete Winchester collection, the complete Stevens collection, over 500 rifles in all and about 50 pistols. We used to shoot and hunt together as a family, had a 100yd rifle range in the back orchard with covered bench rest with 4 shooting positions. My uncle was a federal marshal in charge on incoming fire arms. (played with some fun toys there) I am well aware of the speed that can be had and still hit your target that isn't the point. I believe he could have done it from the depository it is just that final head impact that looks like a frontal hit to me. I can't prove it one way or the other and neither can anyone else so we will have to agree to disagree on that one.
I learned all I need to know about life by killing smart people and eating their brains.
Eat right ,Exercise ,Stay fit, Die Anyway!
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Re: Bin Laden is Dead?
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Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 20,096 Likes: 2
Fe Butt
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Fe Butt
Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 20,096 Likes: 2 |
Quote:
...As far as the alien thing Roswell. I think Jack Nicholson's character in Easyrider said it best.
About 2.5 minutes in.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=73PnAymHAHk
Duuuuude, that was a real cooool link there, Man!!!
(...err, I guess I mean... )
Yep! Just like a good Single Malt Scotch, you might call me "an acquired taste" TOO.(among the many OTHER things you may care to call me, of course)
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Re: Bin Laden is Dead?
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Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 7,028 Likes: 8
New Tires
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New Tires
Joined: Dec 2006
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Most people have no idea what McCarthy was censored for, but they love to throw that ism around. There has been a lot of scholarship done concerning released KGB docs since the Soviet Union disolved. No doubt McCarthy was a drunk and a bully, hell by today's standards he would be a celebrated Senator.
Every normal man must be tempted, at times, to spit on his hands, hoist the black flag, and begin slitting throats.
H. L. Mencken
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Re: Bin Laden is Dead?
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Joined: Feb 2011
Posts: 2,146
Oil Expert
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Oil Expert
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My biggest question on JFK was the "magic" bullet that supposedly hit multiple bones yet appeared as though it was shot into a swimming pool.
I have no opinion on the various theories.
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Re: Bin Laden is Dead?
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Joined: Sep 2010
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Second Wind
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Second Wind
Joined: Sep 2010
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Quote:
I grew up with firearms among some was the complete Winchester collection, the complete Stevens collection, over 500 rifles in all and about 50 pistols. We used to shoot and hunt together as a family, had a 100yd rifle range in the back orchard with covered bench rest with 4 shooting positions. My uncle was a federal marshal in charge on incoming fire arms. (played with some fun toys there) I am well aware of the speed that can be had and still hit your target that isn't the point. I believe he could have done it from the depository it is just that final head impact that looks like a frontal hit to me. I can't prove it one way or the other and neither can anyone else so we will have to agree to disagree on that one.
Is exactly why I neither agree nor disagree. That plus I don't trust big brother for anything. Much less info on a cover up provided by them to cover for them.
I have no faith in human perfectability. I think that human exertion will have no appreciable effect upon humanity. Man is now only more active - not more happy - nor more wise, than he was 6000 years ago.
Edgar Allan Poe
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Re: Bin Laden is Dead?
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Joined: Feb 2011
Posts: 2,146
Oil Expert
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Oil Expert
Joined: Feb 2011
Posts: 2,146 |
Quote:
Most people have no idea what McCarthy was censored for, but they love to throw that ism around. There has been a lot of scholarship done concerning released KGB docs since the Soviet Union disolved. No doubt McCarthy was a drunk and a bully, hell by today's standards he would be a celebrated Senator.
"Censured" not censored. It's a different thing.
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Re: Bin Laden is Dead?
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Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 7,028 Likes: 8
New Tires
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New Tires
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 7,028 Likes: 8 |
Quote:
Found on line and posted to Facebook:
Business Insider: "The military team that killed Osama Bin Laden is an elite special forces group unofficially called Seal Team 6. Officially, the team's name is classified and not available to the public, technically there is no team 6."
Couldn't be too "TOP SECRET", channel surfing I came across an ex member of Seal Team Six on FOX. He must not know the team doesn't exist. Oh! He's the author of a book, Seal Team Six. Going to check it out on Amazon, it's most likely under the category "TOP SECRET". 
Every normal man must be tempted, at times, to spit on his hands, hoist the black flag, and begin slitting throats.
H. L. Mencken
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Re: Bin Laden is Dead?
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Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 7,028 Likes: 8
New Tires
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New Tires
Joined: Dec 2006
Posts: 7,028 Likes: 8 |
Quote:
Quote:
Most people have no idea what McCarthy was censored for, but they love to throw that ism around. There has been a lot of scholarship done concerning released KGB docs since the Soviet Union disolved. No doubt McCarthy was a drunk and a bully, hell by today's standards he would be a celebrated Senator.
"Censured" not censored. It's a different thing.
I know the difference, thanks for correcting my spelling. You missed my misspelling of dissolved.
Every normal man must be tempted, at times, to spit on his hands, hoist the black flag, and begin slitting throats.
H. L. Mencken
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Re: Bin Laden is Dead?
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Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 7,630 Likes: 7
Monkey Butt
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Monkey Butt
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I'm still wondering about the concern over proper burial rites. If it had been up to me he would have been fed to ravenous hogs so he could spend all eternity as a pile of pig sh1t. Considering the touching concern OSB and his ilk have for the treatment of others and the manner in which they treat Christian, and Moslem, dead, such treatment would be well deserved.
We all like to think of ourselves as rugged individualists. But when push comes to shove most of us are sheep who do what we are told. Worst of all, a lot of us become unpaid agents of whoever is controlling the agenda by enforcing the current dogma on the few rugged individualists who actually exist.
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Re: Bin Laden is Dead?
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Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 3,954
Loquacious
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Loquacious
Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 3,954 |
Quote:
I'm still wondering about the concern over proper burial rites. If it had been up to me he would have been fed to ravenous hogs so he could spend all eternity as a pile of pig sh1t. Considering the touching concern OSB and his ilk have for the treatment of others and the manner in which they treat Christian, and Moslem, dead, such treatment would be well deserved.
Well, since his beliefs were particularly Midieval, why not quarter his body and put in on heavily boobytrapped pikes throughout the Middle East. Start with his head in Islamabad, where maybe, with some clues, the Pakistani Army and ISI MIGHT guess whose head it is, then send his unclean left hand to Saudi Arabia, feed his heart and genitals to pigs. Then you can put the rest of his body in places like Syria, Libya and Yemen.... That would be fitting for him, but now we'll probably have to pay a fine for dumping sewage in the ocean!
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Re: Bin Laden is Dead?
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Posts: 18,825
"Lighten up, Francis."
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"Lighten up, Francis."
Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 18,825 |
Did ANYBODY get the Fight Club inference. Jeez...
"The first rule of SEAL Team 6 is..."
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Re: Bin Laden is Dead?
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Joined: Dec 2006
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New Tires
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New Tires
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You guys from Iowa and Colorado are wussies, I would have brought him back alive and turned him loose at ground zero NYC on the 4th of July or maybe 9/11/2011.
Every normal man must be tempted, at times, to spit on his hands, hoist the black flag, and begin slitting throats.
H. L. Mencken
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Re: Bin Laden is Dead?
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Joined: May 2007
Posts: 1,354
Learned Hand
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Learned Hand
Joined: May 2007
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Quote:
Quote:
Found on line and posted to Facebook:
Business Insider: "The military team that killed Osama Bin Laden is an elite special forces group unofficially called Seal Team 6. Officially, the team's name is classified and not available to the public, technically there is no team 6."
Couldn't be too "TOP SECRET", channel surfing I came across an ex member of Seal Team Six on FOX. He must not know the team doesn't exist. Oh! He's the author of a book, Seal Team Six. Going to check it out on Amazon, it's most likely under the category "TOP SECRET".
The things that US submarines are considered top secret, yet there exist plenty of books, websites, etc about submarines. Tom Clancy pushed the limits with "The Hunt for Red October". What you don't hear are the specifics of exactly what some submarines are doing. Nor will you ever hear what they do/did.
Last edited by Conwy; 05/04/2011 1:58 AM.
Blue/White 2007 TBA, Thruxton needles, Unifilter, AI removed, Polaris Bellmouth, Bubs, Nology Coils/wires, Lightbar, Ricor Intiminators, Hagon Nitros, Tall Sissy Bar w/luggage rack, Dart flyscreen & Lowers. 130 Mains, TrueGel Battery MG12-BS.
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Re: Bin Laden is Dead?
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Posts: 3,971
Loquacious
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Loquacious
Joined: May 2006
Posts: 3,971 |
Next you're going to tell me Jack Ruby acted out of patriotism L-shaped ambush, road sign used as reference point Who? I don't know. A Carcano is just laughable. I think someone had a wry sense of humor.
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Re: Bin Laden is Dead?
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Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 18,825
"Lighten up, Francis."
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"Lighten up, Francis."
Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 18,825 |
Leon Panetta acknowledges information from waterboarded detainees was used to help plan mission at bin Laden's compound - NBC News
That's the first acknowledgment of torture I've seen. So there ya go.
But not, apparently, to find him?
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