Bonneville America Forums Forums Rider Safety Forums Riding Technique beginner MSF course or experienced course

I am a self-taught rider, as most of us probably are. Then there was the 18-year gap and I am a newbie again, kinda.

I have had several friends tell me I should take the MSF course, I will learn all kinds of stuff I never knew and will learn some new tricks. These are mostly new riders who took the course.

There is one of these take-the-class guys I have ridden with who does all kinds of stuff that I consider unsafe and scary. (Turns, braking, following too close, blind spots, etc.) He had a bike back in the 80's, too, but just returned to riding this last few years. He is also one of the most verbal about me taking the course. (probably ought to point out that in 3 years he has chalked up maybe 4K miles, not all that much)

This weekend there was a seat in the beginners course and I almost signed up for it. Then I got to thinking that I would spend 2 long days taking a course to cull a few tips that I can use. The weather was great and I decided to ride solo instead.

While in the class site, I read the Experienced Riders Course part. Looks more to my liking: turning techniques, advanced traffic skills, etc. The requirements are that you have ridden for over 6 months and 3000 miles. I have been on the bike about 10 of the last 14 and am a bit over 11K miles, so I qualify for sure.

My question is for those of you who have taken both classes and know what is taught in them. Is there something in the beginner's course that would make it worth my while to spend a weekend in there? Or should I pass Go and shoot straight to the experienced course?

I haven't taken the advanced, but the beginners is good because it helps give you good habbits. I think they assume you have taken it when you take the advanced. Some of the beginner you will find boring like using the clutch, etc, but they go over countersteering, quick stops, etc. You would probably be fine with the advanced but you would definitely get something out of the beginner too.

I can't know your specifics of course but I took the beginners course when I got my america after a long time off. It was only one day and it was good for me because it taught, and gave decent practice, in some basics: Low speed manouvering, swerving (counter-steering), and emergency braking etc.

I probably knew all the stuff (except the low speed part) at some level but the course definitely helped my riding.

I barely passed the test at the end of the day so I would probably not have survived an advanced version. YMMV.

I think the beginner's course was worth it for the slow-speed turns/figure 8's which really teaches us the importance of looking where we want to go.

Hey Gary, I am kinda in the same situation as you. HAd several years w/out a bike and now back at it again. I just signed up for a course here in PA to brush up on some skills and to also get a discount in my insurance. Here in PA regardless of experience, you are required to take the beginners course b4 taking the advanced course. I am actually looking forward to it and plan to come away a safer rider.

The nice thing about the advanced class (at least here in MA) is that you ride your own bike. That was very valuable for me as it taught me to trust my bike when doing tight turns and the like. The beginner course is taught on 250cc school beaters, so if you think you might drop then at least you're dropping the schools' junker instead of your own. Both classes were excellent, IMHO.

I took the beginner course early last year. It was well worth $100 and the weekend that it took. I aced the written test, but did poorly on the skills test. The bikes were small honda types. My old sore arthritic body does not bend to those bikes well and they were actually painful for me to ride. I don't feel the instructor knew as much as I did about counter steering, but I let it go so as not to disturb the class. I do feel the course is a very good basis or foundation to build your skills on and it was easier than going throught the state testing for my motorcycle endorsement for my license. I feel strongly that we all should have our endorsements. I understand there are about 60% that don't.
Dave

I took the beginner course way back in 1996. The instructor ran the course like a salty Marine DI. He emphasized using ones head as gyro over and over. If he noted what appeared as bad habits he would repeatedly stop you and enforce the proper technique.

Looks like the voting is in favor of starting at the beginning. (no pun intended) Guess I'll get a few less blings for the bike and spend the $180 and a weekend to learn what I can and have him point out my bad habits. (only $100 in WA? vacation time?)

The good part, they have about every kind of 250 bike out there and he said I could test out different ones to help me figure out which one my daughter gets when she starts riding. I have thought of the 2 of us taking the class at the same time, another daddy/daughter opportunity. Problem with that is that it won't be until summer sets in and slow riding on hot asphalt in July is not fun here.

Thanks for all your input, guys.

A side note: have you noticed that all the street 250's have forward controls? The manufacturers are copying the cruiser style. So how do you teach a new rider how to rise on pegs going over bumps if he can't stand on the pegs? Not to mention the better balance/control of the bike with the feet below you instead of out front.

I took the beginner class only because I went 15 years without riding and didnt keep my endorsement. Taking the class enabled me to bypass taking the tests at DMV. I wish I would have taken the experienced class, but I would have sill had to take the tests. I am hoping to take the experienced or advanced class this year sometime.

Soren

You guys have to pay? It's free to take it in PA as long as you're licensed there, like I still am.

If you have experience in the saddle I'd go for the advanced course. No matter how many years you've been riding it's pretty good. I took it a few years ago and really enjoyed it. I'll probably take it again in a few years as a refresher. Well worth the time and money.

as one of the newbie riders, let me just say that the class i took had several seasoned riders in it and they didn't do any better at the excercises than the new riders like me who never even touched a bike before that class.
If you are interested in the advanced, i would take the beginner as a refresher course and then take the advance 6 months later. Especially because you use your own bike in the advance... you don't want to dump your own bike. Good luck!

You'll probably get more out of the advanced course if you take the beginners first. If nothing else, you'll have a better undertanding of the terminology used.

You might want to start at step one. I remember statements from the instructors like "You know, if that would have been a big bike it would have been on its side". The small bikes you can actually catch and still not drop them if they do go to the side. They do fun things like get you traveling in a circle and then they step out in front of you. You ain't supposed to run that dude over and your expected to keep that bike under control. And if you almost do wack em and he of course jumps out of the way just in time and your standing there tryin to keep the bike upright, he tells you, "You know, if that would have been a big bike ... " ... The also have some very tight corners they expect you to make, at very slow speeds. They do a good job of teaching you to drive where you are looking, "Target Fixation" ...