 Big Bore
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Joined: Sep 2005
Posts: 183
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Hello, I've been thinking about getting a Big Bore kit for my 2002 America. Has anyone who has done this had any problems with their engine. The stock engine should last quit a long time, will doing this upgrade hurt it any? Other than making it go faster. Is their anything that I should be aware of. I'm not going to do this myself, I'll have to find someone who knows how to do it.
02TBA RED AI Removed,All Snorkels & 3 Baffels Removed, Drilled Airbox, 42Pilots,135Mains Keep On Riding!!!!!!!
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Re: Big Bore
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Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 10,717 Likes: 5
Should be Riding
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Should be Riding
Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 10,717 Likes: 5 |
Always remember to be yourself. Unless you suck. Then pretend to be someone else.
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Re: Big Bore
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Joined: Sep 2007
Posts: 1,668
Learned Hand
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Learned Hand
Joined: Sep 2007
Posts: 1,668 |
I've put over 25,000 miles on my BB and it still rocks!
Howbeit when He, the Spirit of truth, is come; He will guide you in all truth:
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Re: Big Bore
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Joined: Sep 2005
Posts: 3,816
Freelance Jedi Knight
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Freelance Jedi Knight
Joined: Sep 2005
Posts: 3,816 |
its not faster thing its stronger!!!!
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Re: Big Bore
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Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 3,753
Loquacious
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Loquacious
Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 3,753 |
do it do it!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
(Former)05 BA tbike pipes, ai removed, Freak, mikuni hsr 42's, 904, ported/polished head, 1mm oversized valves
NOW-2010 silver and black tbird
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Re: Big Bore
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Joined: Mar 2009
Posts: 12,964
Stickman Yogi
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Stickman Yogi
Joined: Mar 2009
Posts: 12,964 |
Hmmmm, with all this enthusiasm I'm starting to think... do it! Remember when we were young (for those of you who are not young) a 650 was a big bike?! Now a 790 is considered small.
Live to love, love to live.
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Re: Big Bore
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Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 10,717 Likes: 5
Should be Riding
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Should be Riding
Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 10,717 Likes: 5 |
790 is only small in actual measured size compared to other motors available in the bike market.
If it was measured by awesomeness, it would be HUGE!
Always remember to be yourself. Unless you suck. Then pretend to be someone else.
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Re: Big Bore
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Joined: Aug 2005
Posts: 2,726
Loquacious
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Loquacious
Joined: Aug 2005
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ABSOLUTELY NO MORE BANG FOR THE BUCK!
I can't be more emphatic than that.
Bob
2005 America, 904cc - sold. 2014 Trophy SE.
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Re: Big Bore
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Joined: Sep 2005
Posts: 183
Adjunct
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OP
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Thanks for all the positve respondses. Along with the big bore kit, do you have to do anything with the carbs and rejetting? I was thinking that over the Winter I can find someone to do this that has experience. It keeps sounding right.
02TBA RED AI Removed,All Snorkels & 3 Baffels Removed, Drilled Airbox, 42Pilots,135Mains Keep On Riding!!!!!!!
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Re: Big Bore
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Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 3,753
Loquacious
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Loquacious
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just do the big bore, then if you want more do more. you dont have to do anything else.
(Former)05 BA tbike pipes, ai removed, Freak, mikuni hsr 42's, 904, ported/polished head, 1mm oversized valves
NOW-2010 silver and black tbird
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Re: Big Bore
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Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 10,717 Likes: 5
Should be Riding
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Should be Riding
Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 10,717 Likes: 5 |
Yes, you will need to re-jet your carbs. It's very easy to do. Maybe you can have the mechanic do that along with the big bore.
Always remember to be yourself. Unless you suck. Then pretend to be someone else.
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Re: Big Bore
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Joined: Sep 2005
Posts: 183
Adjunct
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OP
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Joined: Sep 2005
Posts: 183 |
Again, thanks for the info. Sounds like maybe I'll give it a try, we'll see if I can find someone who I think can do it and maybe over the winter get it done.
02TBA RED AI Removed,All Snorkels & 3 Baffels Removed, Drilled Airbox, 42Pilots,135Mains Keep On Riding!!!!!!!
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Re: Big Bore
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Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 1,457
Learned Hand
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Learned Hand
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 1,457 |
Question for you Big Bore guys-
I see 10:1, 11.5:1, and 12:1 compression ratios. Which one would be best considering I often commute in 100 degree (F.) heat in stop and go traffic? Also, I've decided on Nikasil, unless anyone has any arguments against it.
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Re: Big Bore
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Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 10,717 Likes: 5
Should be Riding
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Should be Riding
Joined: Aug 2007
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The Wiseco pistons claim to be 10:1, but I have heard that they don't measure up in a compression test, more like in the high 9's. Disappointing to say the least, if I could choose again, it would be 11.5:1 for me. Pump gas will be fine.
Always remember to be yourself. Unless you suck. Then pretend to be someone else.
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Re: Big Bore
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Joined: May 2007
Posts: 6,432 Likes: 1
Worn Saddle
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Worn Saddle
Joined: May 2007
Posts: 6,432 Likes: 1 |
Quote:
Also, I've decided on Nikasil, unless anyone has any arguments against it.
Some time ago there was a rash of trash talking about pressed sleeves vs Nikasil over on the Delphi Forum but the trash talker has since gone to Nikasil in their product as well so I kind of take that as an endorsement.
A positive attitude may not solve all your problems, but it will annoy enough people to make it worth the effort. Herm Albright (1876 - 1944)
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Re: Big Bore
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Joined: Aug 2005
Posts: 2,726
Loquacious
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Loquacious
Joined: Aug 2005
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I have the 10:1 (or is it 10.5:1) Wiseco pistons in my Nikasil barrels. For the same price I could have gotten 11.5:1 pistons but I opted for the standard Wiseco. I use mid grade which has always been fine. If you go up on compression, you might need to try premium.
My goal was to maximize the torque I could get out of the bike from 2500 to 5500 rpm. I didn't really care what the Hp was at 7500. On my current set up I'm getting a max. of 65.54 ft. lbs. at 3408 and almost 75 Hp at redline, but the two cross (5250 rpm) at 59.3. Needless to say I'm very happy.
I also tried a lighter flywheel. It added some top end Hp but lost some torque in the lower rpm range. I had the stock one put back on. Torque is one of the greatest gains with the BB and makes the cost well worth it.
Bob
2005 America, 904cc - sold. 2014 Trophy SE.
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Re: Big Bore
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Joined: Jul 2006
Posts: 948
3/4 Throttle
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3/4 Throttle
Joined: Jul 2006
Posts: 948 |
I had a non-Triumph mechanic tell me not to do it-too hot in Texas-couldn't cool it-everything would go up in a mushroom cloud. I thanked him politely. It seems to me these BB engines are running well in other places hot as Texas.
He is also the same guy who told me the Triumph engine was based on the Kawaski twin which is something I had never heard.
Redbike7
2006 America
No amount of skill can overcome gross stupidity. Ask me how I know...never mind, I forgot...
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Re: Big Bore
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Joined: Jun 2007
Posts: 3,210
Loquacious
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Loquacious
Joined: Jun 2007
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Hey Scott, about a year ago I seen Big Bore advertisements on craigslist by Manayunk Triumph in Philly. I dont see anything on their website about it, but it might be worth looking into contacting them. Keep me posted cause Ive considered it myself, but dont wanny do the work. http://www.manayunktriumph.com/
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Re: Big Bore
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Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 3,753
Loquacious
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Loquacious
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i went with the wiseco kit when i did mine. the stock sleeves bored get very thin. the weisco sleeves are pretty thick. with major heat everything i read says that the weisco kit takes it better and actually gains power while the nikisil expands more because its thin. is that totatlly true? i don't know but makes sense seeing the way both motors look apart. seems the only issue on the weisco kit is who does the sleeves and boring. there are also many more weisco bikes out there that have had zero problems, and i have about 5k on mine and i beat it every time i ride. to bad that delphi forum is not there anymore because even tho they were a pretty harsh group they knew there stuff pretty good. just try and read up as much as you can and go from there. i don't think you can really go wrong either way you decide.
(Former)05 BA tbike pipes, ai removed, Freak, mikuni hsr 42's, 904, ported/polished head, 1mm oversized valves
NOW-2010 silver and black tbird
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Re: Big Bore
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Joined: Jan 2008
Posts: 1,171 Likes: 14
Learned Hand
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Learned Hand
Joined: Jan 2008
Posts: 1,171 Likes: 14 |
Quote:
i went with the wiseco kit when i did mine. the stock sleeves bored get very thin. the weisco sleeves are pretty thick. with major heat everything i read says that the weisco kit takes it better and actually gains power while the nikisil expands more because its thin.
I am going to have to differ with you on this. The wiseco sleeve require a lot more material to be bored out of the stock barrels, both for the main sleeve and a 6mm per side larger shoulder at the top of the bore, the iron sleeve is them shrunk into the aluminum bore. With still plenty of meat left. THe nikasil bores are just 2 mm larger with plating. A lot less metal removed and no wieght added, lower co-efficient of friction between the nikasil bore and the rings. As was previuosly said both types work well.
On the pistons, I have the 12:1, with the head work, I am probably slightly less, but still have to run premium. If doing over would go with the 11 or 11.5:1 pistons. The wiseco piston do not quite measure out equal to the compression values they claim.
Oh and - do it, do it, do it. You won't be able to wipe the grin off (unless you get a new thunderbird)
05 speedmaster - 1100cc, 11:1 racing pistons, Carillo rods, thunderbike cams, ported and polished head, 2mm over intake and exhaust valves, Barnett kevlar clutch, scepter pipes, oversize manifolds, 45mm HSR's, TTP stage 4 firestarter
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Re: Big Bore
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Joined: Jan 2005
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Loquacious
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Loquacious
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the stock sleeves bored that little bit still are much thinner than the weisco sleeves. either way until we see both kits with lots of miles on them we wont know. but so far both seem to be reliable and i know of a few guys who have 30-40k on there weisco kits.
(Former)05 BA tbike pipes, ai removed, Freak, mikuni hsr 42's, 904, ported/polished head, 1mm oversized valves
NOW-2010 silver and black tbird
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Re: Big Bore
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Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 2,531
Loquacious
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Loquacious
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 my Bonnie-A is a new bike........p.s. spring for the oil pressure gauge ! it is functional & it looks hot !  go for it !
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Re: Big Bore
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Joined: Jul 2006
Posts: 948
3/4 Throttle
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3/4 Throttle
Joined: Jul 2006
Posts: 948 |
Does anyone in the hot south/southwest have a big bore kit with over say 20,000 miles? It's been up to 105 in central Texas a dozen times this year-unusual to be that hot that long. That is my remaining concern about the kits-can they hold up in that heat? I barely can.
Redbike7
2006 America
No amount of skill can overcome gross stupidity. Ask me how I know...never mind, I forgot...
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Re: Big Bore
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Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 3,753
Loquacious
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Loquacious
Joined: Jan 2005
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(Former)05 BA tbike pipes, ai removed, Freak, mikuni hsr 42's, 904, ported/polished head, 1mm oversized valves
NOW-2010 silver and black tbird
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Re: Big Bore
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Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 10,717 Likes: 5
Should be Riding
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Should be Riding
Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 10,717 Likes: 5 |
Quote:
The Wiseco pistons claim to be 10.5:1, but I have heard that they don't measure up in a compression test, more like in the high 9's. Disappointing to say the least, if I could choose again, it would be 11.5:1 for me. Pump gas will be fine.
Looks like others are starting to find out the same thing
http://newbonnevilleriders.com/forum/showthread.php?t=3896
Always remember to be yourself. Unless you suck. Then pretend to be someone else.
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Re: Big Bore
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Joined: Mar 2007
Posts: 5,616
Check Pants
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Check Pants
Joined: Mar 2007
Posts: 5,616 |
Ive been following that thread over at NBR. If the HP loss due to a .8 difference in compression is that significant then the 904 kit even on a 865 motor would be well worth it*. This has been a topic of constant debate in my head (should I shouldnt I?).  So whats .8 worth? * given that we know theres a difference in cams and new cams would be a part of that upgrade.
Last edited by Zmilin; 07/15/2009 9:49 AM.
SOLD: 07 Black BA, 39mm FCRs, TPUSA stage 1 head, TPUSA 813 cams, TPUSA 10.8:1 pistons, TTP #3 igniter, Specialty Spares Long Cannons, Tsukayu Hard Bags. 82HP/55tq
NEW: 19 Goldwing Tour DCT
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Re: Big Bore
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Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 10,717 Likes: 5
Should be Riding
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Should be Riding
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I'm going to be curious that if there is a recall, will they pay for the engine tear-down to install the new pistons as well? I would think they should due to the fact they are selling pistons that aren't as advertised.
Always remember to be yourself. Unless you suck. Then pretend to be someone else.
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Re: Big Bore
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I guess that explains a few things but doesn't change the fact that the larger pistons create more torque and Hp. I've had no problem with mid grade gas. Makes sense if the compression isn't much different.
When I did a compression check on my 904, both cylinders hit right at 175. That doesn't seem much more than the stock would be. BUT, the bike runs great and has all the power and more than I'd hoped for.
Bob
2005 America, 904cc - sold. 2014 Trophy SE.
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Re: Big Bore
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Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 10,717 Likes: 5
Should be Riding
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Should be Riding
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Quote:
When I did a compression check on my 904, both cylinders hit right at 175. That doesn't seem much more than the stock would be. BUT, the bike runs great and has all the power and more than I'd hoped for.
I need to check mine, but I would imagine it's about the same, around 175. It should be closer to 200 I think, at least in the 190+ range. While I agree that like yours, mine runs great and has so much more power and torque than stock, if Wiseco sold their pistons under false pretense, they should have to cover the cost to make it right. For what we spend on these to do the 904, the very least we can ask for is that we get what is advertised. Tell me it's 10.5:1 and it ends up being 9.7:1, well, it's up to the company to make it right.
Always remember to be yourself. Unless you suck. Then pretend to be someone else.
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Re: Big Bore
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Joined: Aug 2005
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Dave, let me know if you hear of any class action suit. They did advertise 10.5:1 and I opted for the Wiseco over 12:1 ones I could have had for the same price. I might have chosen differently if they had been advertised correctly.
I wasn't sure I wanted to increase the compression too much at the time. There must be some advantage to staying nearer a normal compression range although I'm not sure what that might be.
It would cost a fortune to pay to replace all misrepresented pistons with all the labor. It might just put Wiseco out of business. I doubt that would happen. Still, I'd like to know what becomes of all this as I do have a vested interest.
Bob
2005 America, 904cc - sold. 2014 Trophy SE.
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Re: Big Bore
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Joined: Aug 2007
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Should be Riding
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Should be Riding
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Bill Gately was the one who convinced me to go with the Wiseco pistons over the 11.5 and 12 ones available. I would have gone with a different piston for sure if I had known. I brought up the possibility of a class action suit on the other forum. I know we have enough people with the 904 to make some noise. The more I think of it, the more it kind of aggravates me. Wiseco should be a company that does it's research and development, why didn't they catch this long ago? Or maybe they did and hoped nobody else would.
Always remember to be yourself. Unless you suck. Then pretend to be someone else.
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Re: Big Bore
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Joined: Aug 2005
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Quote:
Bill Gately was the one who convinced me to go with the Wiseco pistons over the 11.5 and 12 ones available.
What was his reasoning? Is there any advantage to not going to higher compression?
Bob
2005 America, 904cc - sold. 2014 Trophy SE.
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Re: Big Bore
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Joined: Aug 2007
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Should be Riding
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Should be Riding
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Well, there was the pump gas reasoning (ethanol, sub premium gas stations), the cold weather reasoning (I ride in the cold and starting could be an issue), but I would imagine it was the fact that he sells Wiseco pistons.  I don't hold it against him, I don't think he knew about this until yesterday.
Always remember to be yourself. Unless you suck. Then pretend to be someone else.
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