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Anti-star trek rant
#331498 05/11/2009 10:29 PM
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Disclaimer:DON'T READ THIS IF YOU HAVEN'T SEEN IT YET. I'll try not to spoil it if you can't help yourself. Saw it last night right after reading all the glowing accounts from the fella's here. Jeeez, and you guys are usually alllllright! Nuts to the new one. Rule # 1, ya just don't change the future by going into the past. You tease with it, almost do it, BUT YA JUST DON'T DO IT! Okay, you were too lazy to think up a really good plot, so ya do it anyway. You just expain it away by having a principal character state "This might be an alternate universe", or words to that effect! CRAP! Now you don't have to adhere to ANY of the star trek lore or history. You can say anything ya want. Maybe we'll find out that spock is actually a woman and Kirk is his long lost brother cause, after all, THIS IS AN ALTERNATE UNIVERSE!, after all. And lets get ALL of the original cast members, all on the ship at the same time, cause it's just plain fun! Cheesy. And Kirk becomes the captain of the Enterprise the FIRST TIME HE SETS FOOT ON IT? Yeah, riiiiiight. Cheesy.
The weapons on the Enterprise look like pop guns. (okay, I know this is an early Enterprise, I'll forgive the later weapons upgrade) The internal working of the starship? What, they used an old gas refinery as a prop cause it was cheap to do? Miles and miles of big ole pipe.This is a futuristic starship, for gods sake! Cheesy. I'll quit now. I'm not a trekkie, but I'll bet the real ones are having a cow about all the liberties they took with the lore. Now then, you can all take turns kicking my Buette, but please, no pushing and shoving, and everybody take turns.


Fidelis et Fortis
Re: Anti-star trek rant
arstaren #331499 05/11/2009 10:32 PM
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Re: Anti-star trek rant
FriarJohn #331500 05/11/2009 11:03 PM
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Rich, Rich, Rich... pipe laden old refineries make excellent star ships (ref. "Alien").


Thom I might be wrong, I sometimes am.
Re: Anti-star trek rant
ThomWill #331501 05/11/2009 11:22 PM
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The refiner wasnt the star ship....it was the place where the recruite departed from to go to the starship.


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Re: Anti-star trek rant
ThomWill #331502 05/11/2009 11:27 PM
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Quote:

Rich, Rich, Rich... pipe laden old refineries make excellent star ships (ref. "Alien").


Nope, Tom, ain't going for it. As I remember it, "Alien" was pipes, but in tight, close corridors, which led to a claustrophobic effect, and believable space ship design. On the Enterprise, it as a huge warehouse looking thing, with monstrous pipes and catwalks.


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Re: Anti-star trek rant
arstaren #331503 05/11/2009 11:34 PM
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I'll comment on one more thing before I go to bed. You don't blow up a planet, as a plot device, which figures in lots and lots of episodes and scenes in Kirk's and Spocks future. Oh, EXCUSE ME!, this is an "ALTERNATE" universe. Crap. Poor, irresponsible and lazy story telling. Tommorrow I'll read the chewings.


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Re: Anti-star trek rant
arstaren #331504 05/12/2009 12:01 AM
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Awe come on! Old Spock is planning the right the time-space continuem for the sequel, or one of the sequels. Anyway, it was still a cool flick.


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Re: Anti-star trek rant
Preacher #331505 05/12/2009 12:36 AM
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It's not an alternate universe. It's the same universe that is being rewritten by a temporal event. The people in the universe, the ones who survived, are still mostly the same people. While it's a bit of a coincidence that the same crew still all end up on the Enterprise, that's a conceit I'll buy.


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Re: Anti-star trek rant
arstaren #331506 05/12/2009 1:53 AM
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Science Fiction.
Plot devices such as time travel, disruption of temporal norms, Deus ex machina, suspension of reality, etc. are de rigueur in the genre.

And cheesy? He!! yeah. It's supposed to be. That's all part of the fun.

I bet you agree with those "interviewees" on The Onion site.

You want "reality", watch The History Channel.

(Oh, and "Spock" is a proper name and thus should be capitalized).


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Re: Anti-star trek rant
bigbill #331507 05/12/2009 7:38 AM
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Quote:

(Oh, and "Spock" is a proper name and thus should be capitalized).




If he had female children would they be called "Spockettes?" And more importantly when grown, would they have 17 teeth or 18?

I remember "The Trouble with Tribbles", was this filmed before or after that ??

jh


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Re: Anti-star trek rant
arstaren #331508 05/12/2009 7:45 AM
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I think it just might be a case of having too much time on his hands

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Re: Anti-star trek rant
JimF #331509 05/12/2009 9:45 AM
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I loved the old show because it was cheesy, just like Dark Shadows, loved that one too. They remade that and they did it too well and I didn't like it.


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Re: Anti-star trek rant
The_Dog33 #331510 05/12/2009 10:03 AM
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I did hear that a small consortium of hard core Trek geeks were horrified by the film.

Much as I respect their right to feel that way I will still insist that the film for the vast majority of us was a joy to watch and moreover......its likely to really clean up at the box office....

and for the record thats what counts to the film makers.


"Proud to be an Infidel" ... "100% pure American Jingoist"
Re: Anti-star trek rant
clanrickarde #331511 05/12/2009 10:59 AM
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It is what it is. The new McMovie was entertaining, especially for fans newer to Star Trek. Not the best movie in the series by any stretch of the imagination, but I am glad I ventured out to see it.

I'll wait for the DVD to see it again though.


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Re: Anti-star trek rant
The_Dog33 #331512 05/12/2009 10:28 PM
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Quote:

I loved the old show because it was cheesy,


Ian, I didn't mean "cheesy" as in cheaply done, but as in poorly thought out. I liked the old show, and most of the movies. But, they followed and were consistant with an established set of facts and values. Here's the thing. I really WANTED to be entertained by watching the history of Kirk and Spocks formative years. Not some made up and sort of related retelling that ignores previous fun tellings of the Star Trek saga. It was like the second Superman movie, with Chris Reeves. He's already the Superman we all know and love, and all of a sudden, BAM! He's got telekinesis too?!! A good story teller/scripter doesn't mess around with the characters and stories people already love. When I go see Spiderman, I wanna see him spin webs and be a smarta$$, like in the established comic. I don't want a writer changing the story and giving him, for instance, a venomous bite and the ability to suck power out of his foes with his fangs! DON'T MESS WITH THE BACK STORY! IT'S ALREADY A GREAT STORY!, its just plain lazy to refuse to work within the already wonderful framework as laid out by Roddenberry. Rant over now. I DID think I would be given a better shellacking by the rest of the good fella's here, though. I guess I need to point out the problems with the "elevator" scenes in the movie!


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Re: Anti-star trek rant
arstaren #331513 05/13/2009 8:23 AM
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Quote:

I really WANTED to be entertained by watching the history of Kirk and Spocks formative years.




The problem with that is that the hardcore fans have had that stuff for years in the form of novels. I don't see J.J. Abrams just regurgitating other peoples work.

I saw it last night and have to say I liked it. I liked the old refinery style engine room, something different from the sci-fi we're used to which usually has a "magic" area that is considered the engine/propulsion system.

I also liked the fact that it simply makes a change which has repercussions on everything to come, making it a first time scenerio once again. Think of it like dropping a pebble into a still pond and watch how the waves radiate out.

All in all I thought it was a well done reboot by changing a few things, it makes it a new world. This keeps the hardcore fans happy while making it fresh again. After all we've seen what happens when they scrub everything and start from scratch, it never works out in the end.


John Like a dog on a car ride with my tongue in the wind
Re: Anti-star trek rant
wojo #331514 05/13/2009 8:32 AM
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I haven't seen it yet but the alternate time line has been done in Trek several times. I have been a big fan of the original Trek since I was a kid so I am aprehensive but open minded.


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Re: Anti-star trek rant
The_Dog33 #331515 05/13/2009 9:31 PM
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I think respectfully what is being missed here is this.....

The original series was as cheesy as 10 year old true aged french (spit) blue cheese.

Representations of various aliens and monsters that Kirk and company did combat with took cheezy to an extreme.

In that regard I think its hard to criticize the new film much.

Leonard Nimoy seems to be enthralled with it. Therefore the new film MUST be logically correct to the Roddenberry ethic.


"Proud to be an Infidel" ... "100% pure American Jingoist"
Re: Anti-star trek rant
wojo #331516 05/13/2009 9:41 PM
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The problem with that is that the hardcore fans have had that stuff for years in the form of novels. I don't see J.J. Abrams just regurgitating other peoples work.



I think you made some good points here. Well said.


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Re: Anti-star trek rant
arstaren #331517 05/13/2009 11:08 PM
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Quote:

You don't blow up a planet, as a plot device,




see Star Wars: A New Hope


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Re: Anti-star trek rant
neight #331518 05/13/2009 11:43 PM
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Quote:

Quote:

You don't blow up a planet, as a plot device,




see Star Wars: A New Hope




Ditto. And of course you blow up planets in a space sci fi flick.

Any self respecting protagonistic villain who hates the federation must want to blow up a federation planet.

Theres something charismatic about the destruction of a planet and all its inhabitants in tons of sci fi space travel genres.


"Proud to be an Infidel" ... "100% pure American Jingoist"
Re: Anti-star trek rant
clanrickarde #331519 05/14/2009 12:36 AM
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Quote:

I think respectfully what is being missed here is this.....

The original series was as cheesy as 10 year old true aged french (spit) blue cheese.

Representations of various aliens and monsters that Kirk and company did combat with took cheezy to an extreme.





Okay Kevin(and a few of you others here), so special effects have progressed a thousand-fold these past 40-plus years since the original "Star Trek" first was telecast thursday nights on NBC, and yes some, if not most of the action/fight scenes weren't exactly choreographed to precision either, HOWEVER to call that series "chessy" in the general sense is a VERY BIG misnomer, as that series was about MUCH MORE than special effects OR action scenes.

It was much MORE about the relationship between not only the crew members of the Starship Enterprise and the other inhabitants of the universe said crew might encounter along their travels, but it often touched upon the deeper questions in life.

(...and whenever that show ventured in that direction, which was often, it was seldomly "cheesy"!!!!!!!)


Yep! Just like a good Single Malt Scotch, you might call me "an acquired taste" TOO.(among the many OTHER things you may care to call me, of course)
Re: Anti-star trek rant
Dwight #331520 05/14/2009 6:19 AM
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I loved this movie it was a total geekfest and i had a blast watching not only the movie but the people who went to see it


Chris

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Re: Anti-star trek rant
arstaren #331521 05/14/2009 10:49 AM
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I've only seen the TV ads but, because of them, I have second thoughts about paying to see it. For decades, film makers have used painted backdrops, but the clip where someone is standing with the academy in the background, it is the least realistic painted backdrop I've ever seen.
In the ad, they have a short clip of someone, presumably captain jerk, making whoopy. That tells me that they ran out of plot ideas and had to resort to shagging scenes for a filler.

To bad there are few, if any, recordings of Space Patrol around and Hollywood is too stupid to look into it. That was a top notch series.


Let's hope there's intelligent life somewhere in space 'cause it's buggar all down here. -- Monte Python
Re: Anti-star trek rant
Greybeard #331522 05/14/2009 10:58 AM
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Things I didn't like about the film:
1. A Beastie Boys song felt a little out of place
2. Leonard Nimoy's false teeth look dated for the time
3. Simon Pegg was under used (The Willy Wonka tube scene: dumb)
4. Tyler Perry is ... Madea goes to Star Fleet?
5. Kirk hooking up with green women is almost cliche
6. Plot hole, after plot hole
7. young Spock meets old Spock...have you learned nothing from the lessons of Doc Brown?

Re: Anti-star trek rant
Mikey790 #331523 05/14/2009 1:31 PM
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Quote:

7. young Spock meets old Spock...have you learned nothing from the lessons of Doc Brown?




Maybe they are going to make another movie and steal the Futurama episode where Fry is immune to the giant brains because he is his own grandfather.


Let's hope there's intelligent life somewhere in space 'cause it's buggar all down here. -- Monte Python
Re: Anti-star trek rant
Greybeard #331524 05/14/2009 1:49 PM
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Re: Anti-star trek rant
Mikey790 #331525 05/14/2009 2:18 PM
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Quote:

1. A Beastie Boys song felt a little out of place




Maybe, but the way I thought about it was here's a kid driving an old classic corvette listening to what then would be considered old classic music. Could they have picked a different tune? Sure but geez it's only playing for what? 40 seconds?

Quote:

2. Leonard Nimoy's false teeth look dated for the time




You want future dentures?

Quote:

3. Simon Pegg was under used (The Willy Wonka tube scene: dumb)




I have to agree with you there but then again I'm sure he'll have a bigger roll in the next one. The tube scene was dumb, agreed.

Quote:

4. Tyler Perry is ... Madea goes to Star Fleet?




Samuel L. Jackson in Star Wars anyone? Actors can be fans too.

Quote:

5. Kirk hooking up with green women is almost cliche




I think that was the point.

Quote:

6. Plot hole, after plot hole




ummm. like what?

Quote:

7. young Spock meets old Spock...have you learned nothing from the lessons of Doc Brown?




And those movies used real science didn't they?


John Like a dog on a car ride with my tongue in the wind
Re: Anti-star trek rant
wojo #331526 05/14/2009 3:29 PM
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What was the Beastie Boys song? Intergalacticplanetary?


Always remember to be yourself. Unless you suck. Then pretend to be someone else.
Re: Anti-star trek rant
neight #331527 05/14/2009 9:51 PM
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Quote:

Quote:

You don't blow up a planet, as a plot device,




see Star Wars: A New Hope


You missed my point. I don't have a problem with blowing up a planet, just blowing up a planet that regularly, and centrally, figures in "future" episodes of Star Trek. Coincides with my critisisim of the "alternate" reality plotline.


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Re: Anti-star trek rant
arstaren #331528 05/14/2009 10:16 PM
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there was lots of cliches
dude in the red skydive suite gets killed
kirk with no shirt on
every mccoy line
and so many more they did a great job on this movie!!!


Chris

Pain heals, Chicks dig scars, and Glory last forever.
Re: Anti-star trek rant
stern12 #331529 05/14/2009 10:22 PM
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I haven't seen the movie but Kirk with the green chick comes from more than 1 episode. The pilot with Pike, the cut double episode made from the pilot and the episode with Lord Garth in the insane asylum.


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Re: Anti-star trek rant
Greybeard #331530 05/15/2009 12:15 AM
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Greybeard, don't worry, there's no "making whoopie" in the movie. There is some mild kissing that gets interrupted. Not that Kirk doesn't want to practically through the whole movie but he's too busy getting his butt kicked by just about everybody: Romulans, cadets, Spock, heck even Bones (with hyposprays).


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Re: Anti-star trek rant
arstaren #331531 07/30/2009 5:56 PM
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I liked it, good flick

Re: Anti-star trek rant
hill8586 #331532 07/31/2009 2:54 PM
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My biggest problem with the movie (I haven't seen it) is that I just read through that whole thread. Yes, I should be working, but I'm not.


Ride On! Airguy -------------------- You gotta' be smart to be lazy(and get a job done)
Re: Anti-star trek rant
airguy #331533 08/02/2009 12:11 AM
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I liked the action, but as for the story... My wife who grew up on Star Trek is still in shock and has not recovered yet. It's still a subject I can not bring up with out catching a lot of grief. Destroying Vulcan was a bit to much for me. Also folks... I'm sorry I just don't get the love Jones thing between Spock and Uhura. In fact it kind of creeps me out.


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