 Bike won't start. Any DIY ideas?
|
Joined: Jun 2008
Posts: 257
Adjunct
|
OP
Adjunct
Joined: Jun 2008
Posts: 257 |
Hey gang,
My bike is a 2008 America, carburated. I haven't been riding in about a month, but I have been starting it regularly.
this weekend it would not start.
It will crank, but won't turn over.
There IS gas in it.
Any ideas?
When my lawnmower won't start, I spray a little starting fluid in the air filter. Will this work with a motorcycle?
Any ideas appreciated.
Thanks
Joe
|
|
|
Re: Bike won't start. Any DIY ideas?
|
Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 11,126 Likes: 13
Should be Riding
|
|
Should be Riding
Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 11,126 Likes: 13 |
Quote:
It will crank, but won't turn over.
"Political intelligence" or what? If it turns over but does not start up...
And given that you don't think it is a fuel delivery problem, I would pull the plugs and have a look at them. Checking the electrical connections for the spark plug wires and the coils. I know you wrote that the thing was starting up but given that it isn't now, check em.
You could use some starting fluid. Carb cleaner is a bit less harsh on things.
If it want's to run with carb cleaner/starting fluid you have a fuel delivery problem. Meaning no fuel being delivered due to an obstructed fuel line or clogged jets. However the likelihood of both carb idle circuits being gummed up are slim. More likely the hidden filter. Just how old is the gas?
Did you ever figure out why it died in the rain?
Blowing gravel off rural roads
|
|
|
Re: Bike won't start. Any DIY ideas?
|
Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 10,730 Likes: 5
Should be Riding
|
|
Should be Riding
Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 10,730 Likes: 5 |
I would NOT use starting fluid. Once you do that, it becomes "addicted" to it, requiring the use of it more and more until it never starts on its own in the cold without it
Always remember to be yourself. Unless you suck. Then pretend to be someone else.
|
|
|
Re: Bike won't start. Any DIY ideas?
|
Joined: Feb 2006
Posts: 3,099
Loquacious
|
|
Loquacious
Joined: Feb 2006
Posts: 3,099 |
Wow! I've always thought that.
Ether forces a motor to fire,
and washes the oil from the
cylinder walls. Not good.
|
|
|
Re: Bike won't start. Any DIY ideas?
|
Joined: Feb 2007
Posts: 23,225 Likes: 62
Fe Butt
|
|
Fe Butt
Joined: Feb 2007
Posts: 23,225 Likes: 62 |
I quick shot of either just to see if it will fire shouldn't hurt anything but I would rather find the problem first and only do that as a last resort. (I actually wouldn't use the either , I would find the problem) Could be some moisture in the fuel and if the place you keep it isn't heated you may have a frozen gas line. If not that then maybe a clogged fuel filter. Check for spark too. Eliminate all the simple problems before you go taking things apart. I can think of other issues but it's easy to check for spark. Pull the fuel line and see if you get fuel out of it. If so then pull the carb bowls and put a rag under the carbs then turn the gas on again and see if you get gas. You can do that by just opening the drains on the bowls too but you may get some left over gas from the bowls. That's why I would pull them off.
EDIT:
If it turns out you are not getting gas leave the bowls off the carbs and open the gas cap and wait a minute. If you get gas then you have a clogged vent.
Last edited by The_Dog33; 11/24/2008 11:52 PM.
I learned all I need to know about life by killing smart people and eating their brains.
Eat right ,Exercise ,Stay fit, Die Anyway!
|
|
|
Re: Bike won't start. Any DIY ideas?
|
Joined: Jul 2008
Posts: 1,440
Learned Hand
|
|
Learned Hand
Joined: Jul 2008
Posts: 1,440 |
Quote:
My bike is a 2008 America, carburated. I haven't been riding in about a month, but I have been starting it regularly.
this weekend it would not start.
That's a really new model to have any of the usual "down the road" issues. This might be infant mortality of some sort. Luckily, it's in warranty. If you poke around some and don't see anything obvious, hightail it over to the dealer. I wouldn't spend a lot of time dissecting it unless the dealer's very far away. If worse comes to worse, you can rent a MC trailer from U-Haul for about $15/day. Good luck - these are great bikes!
'08 America Blue/White; Custom Headlamps, Custom Lowers, Clearview 20", Bafflectomy
|
|
|
Re: Bike won't start. Any DIY ideas?
|
Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 2,362
Oil Expert
|
|
Oil Expert
Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 2,362 |
Quote:
Luckily, it's in warranty. If you poke around some and don't see anything obvious, hightail it over to the dealer. I wouldn't spend a lot of time dissecting it unless the dealer's very far away.
Snap. If you have a warranty use it. If you poke around too much and don't really know what you're doing the dealer can claim (right or wrong) that you voided the warranty.
Are you sure it's not something silly like the petcock or the kill switch turned off? You'll feel like a complete git trailering your bike to the dealer for something like that, and you wouldn't be the first to do it.
|
|
|
Re: Bike won't start. Any DIY ideas?
|
Joined: Jun 2008
Posts: 257
Adjunct
|
|
OP
Adjunct
Joined: Jun 2008
Posts: 257 |
Thanks for the input all. I think after hearing all this, I'm just going to call the dealer. I'm not a mechanic and dont want to screw things up.
Sandman its not the petcock or kill switch. Checked 'em.
Moe, I brought it to the dealer after the rain/stall incident and he made some adjustments and it never happened again.
|
|
|
Re: Bike won't start. Any DIY ideas?
|
Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 6,308 Likes: 4
Worn Saddle
|
|
Worn Saddle
Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 6,308 Likes: 4 |
Quote:
Thanks for the input all. I think after hearing all this, I'm just going to call the dealer. I'm not a mechanic and dont want to screw things up.
Sandman its not the petcock or kill switch. Checked 'em.
Moe, I brought it to the dealer after the rain/stall incident and he made some adjustments and it never happened again.
Dood,
how far are you from us up here in the NY finger lakes area? Between Me, the Yute, Biker and the local breweries, we can get it runing in 30 minutes....TOPS! guar-un-teed. (assuming you buy or bring the beer)
(above D)
Bring bike here. (beer should be in cooler, but it's cold, we can forgo that part for now)
If not.....
Ok, for free....
3 things make the bike run.
Spark
Gas
air
it's not rocket science, unless... you want it to be.
1) SPARK - you got spark? No? see below A.
2) Gas? you say you got gas? see Below B
3) Air - izzit breathin? If so see below C
Below A: (This is where I said to see right?)
Pull plug (either one) Plug spark plug cable onto this exposed plug. Set plug (with wire attached) so that it is is contact with the motor.
Turn motor over - does it send a really big shock up your arm? if so, let go of the spark plug.
Try again... turn motor over with plug threads in contact with the fins on the motor - hit starter button - does it spark nice and pretty BLUE? If so - YOU GOT SPARK! Check BOTH plugs. If no spark, insert NEW spark plugs, then try again. If no go, sux to be you, see above D.
Below B ( no gas)
No beer drinking allowed for this step.
Extinquish all flames.
Unhook petcock feed from underneath tank.
Insert can underneath gas feed line.
Turn on gas feed petcock on tank.
Gas flowinginto can? You got gas.
No gas flowing into can? You got no gas - follow it bassackwards - not too much to figure out here.
Below C: No air
If you got spark, gas from above then it should usually start. Remove/clean air filters. Start over.
For further directions, see above D.
A word to the wise is not necessary. It is the stupid ones who need the advice.
Pat
|
|
|
Re: Bike won't start. Any DIY ideas?
|
Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 2,531
Loquacious
|
|
Loquacious
Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 2,531 |
Quote:
I would NOT use starting fluid. Once you do that, it becomes "addicted" to it, requiring the use of it more and more until it never starts on its own in the cold without it
The next thing you notice small change and pawnable items missing, eventually the police call, they ask you to come down and identify a bike they are holding for either charges.  and it is your strung-out baby! Just say no ! 
|
|
|
Re: Bike won't start. Any DIY ideas?
|
Joined: Jun 2008
Posts: 257
Adjunct
|
|
OP
Adjunct
Joined: Jun 2008
Posts: 257 |
Follow up - according to dealer, the problem was "sediment in the bowls."
Thanks for help, all.
|
|
|
Re: Bike won't start. Any DIY ideas?
|
Joined: Sep 2007
Posts: 42
Greenhorn
|
|
Greenhorn
Joined: Sep 2007
Posts: 42 |
Help those of us less mechanically inclined. What's likely the reason for sediment in bowls on such a new bike? Old gas? Thanks.
|
|
|
Re: Bike won't start. Any DIY ideas?
|
Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 11,126 Likes: 13
Should be Riding
|
|
Should be Riding
Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 11,126 Likes: 13 |
Dirty gas (see below). Paint flakes from the tank. Storing the sickle with less than a full tank over major temperature swings (condensation=rust)
PersonalTriumph ,
So it was clogged jets after all? Dang. Both carbs too. What are the odds? You must have filled up at a station right after a fuel delivery.
Blowing gravel off rural roads
|
|
|
Re: Bike won't start. Any DIY ideas?
|
Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 11,126 Likes: 13
Should be Riding
|
|
Should be Riding
Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 11,126 Likes: 13 |
When I liberated Vera Lynn from the stealership way back in Oct 2001, I got her with, yeah mon, dirty gas. Took the turds three visits to finger it out, or rather for me to take it to another stealer... That was the last time they touched my dear gal. And the second to the last time the other stealer touched her too. I feel a rant arising.  Glad you got her sorted out and back under you.
Blowing gravel off rural roads
|
|
|
Re: Bike won't start. Any DIY ideas?
|
Joined: Nov 2008
Posts: 35
Greenhorn
|
|
Greenhorn
Joined: Nov 2008
Posts: 35 |
Thoughts on ether.
Works great on old diesels with (((NO))) glow plugs.
Anything else use WD-40.
Ether burns up glow plugs and thusly comes addiction to it.
WD-40 will lubricate the cylinder walls and it wont kill glow plugs.
I have never had a gas burner need any of this stuff and a diesel is the only thing WD-40 it is good for.
CRC-2-26 is a much better lubricant, I use it on e everything including my guns.
Get it at an electrical supply house or home depot in the electrical section.
It is GOOD STUFF.
Glad to see your scoot is fixed and don't buy gas there again.
Cheers,
Worth
08 speedy black
|
|
|
Re: Bike won't start. Any DIY ideas?
|
Joined: Jul 2008
Posts: 1,440
Learned Hand
|
|
Learned Hand
Joined: Jul 2008
Posts: 1,440 |
What I want to know is, how would sediment/rust/paint flakes make it past the hidden fuel filter??? Doesn't the filter usually clog up when least expected, precisely because it won't pass this junk??
'08 America Blue/White; Custom Headlamps, Custom Lowers, Clearview 20", Bafflectomy
|
|
|
Re: Bike won't start. Any DIY ideas?
|
Joined: Nov 2008
Posts: 94
Member
|
|
Member
Joined: Nov 2008
Posts: 94 |
Over here we get problems if petrol is left sitting (particularly in carbs, but sometimes in injectors) for more than a couple of months. This modern unleaded stuff dries out and jellifies then becomes a hard residue which clogs up the jets. It looks like a white crust. At a guess US gas isn't too disimilar. So if this bike was sat in the dealers for any length of time, this could be the cause.
|
|
|
Re: Bike won't start. Any DIY ideas?
|
Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 11,126 Likes: 13
Should be Riding
|
|
Should be Riding
Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 11,126 Likes: 13 |
Quote:
What I want to know is, how would sediment/rust/paint flakes make it past the hidden fuel filter??? Doesn't the filter usually clog up when least expected, precisely because it won't pass this junk??
bypass. the filter must be unseating on the t connector. given the fuel filter sits within the connector and the fuel line goes round them both. Any lifting will allow trapped grunge to pass. the fuel line is un-seating the filter with it. If you look at the filter, two sides have flats. These flats don't seal on the fuel line like the t connector does. You get blowby with no leaking due to the hidden filter flats. Either when you reattach the line, or more likely, under operation, this lifting of the filter. The rust that passes is silt, which is no good in any form. Paint flakes again have to slip past the filter.
I know how tight the fit is between the filter and the fuel-line 't' are. Spooning away... just trying to remove the filter after the fuel line is removed from the fuel-line 't' is a pita. Thee fuel line that should be unseating the beast.
So exactly what is under operation? Vibrations. pressure differentials tween bowls and tank. Heat cycles of the rubber fuel line allowing the hose to swell and contract. I dunno know. but i do know that items too large to pass the filter, do get in the bowls.
Sounds a bit like black magic.
I bet those with an in-line fuel filter don't have a problem with bypass.
Blowing gravel off rural roads
|
|
|
Re: Bike won't start. Any DIY ideas?
|
Joined: Nov 2008
Posts: 94
Member
|
|
Member
Joined: Nov 2008
Posts: 94 |
any gunge would have to pass through the petcock filter first before it got to the hidden filter.
Last edited by Monkey865; 12/12/2008 3:30 PM.
|
|
|
Re: Bike won't start. Any DIY ideas?
|
Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 11,126 Likes: 13
Should be Riding
|
|
Should be Riding
Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 11,126 Likes: 13 |
that area too is prone to blow by. The stalks are pressed into the petcock. friction is what holds them in place. Each area, the T and the petcock, have filters that should they leak, will pass trash, being in the fuel source as they are. again, the only sure fire filter would be an in-line filter, as there could be no blowby. just a puddle of gas on the case.
Blowing gravel off rural roads
|
|
|
|
|
