 Re: New Thunderbird ...wow
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Loquacious
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Loquacious
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If you recall SOME people insisted the bike would be in showrooms in 2006, then 2007, then 2008.
I recall nothing of the sort. The first I ever heard about showrooms was for 2008 (then delayed into '09).
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The latest delay was that Triumph was upgrading from a 5-speed to a 6-speed.  Come on...
And your implication here is ... what exactly?
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I hope the TBird be worth the wait for those of you that'll add one to the stable.
It will.
St. Petersburg ... Moscow ... Miami ... LA ... DC ... here I come! 
Bedouin.
Blessed are those eyes that have seen more roads than any man! (Homer).
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Re: New Thunderbird ...wow
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Learned Hand
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I'm looking for a low slung "sport" version...
Warren
04 Caspian Blue and Silver America
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Re: New Thunderbird ...wow
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My name is phil . . . I ride a TRIUMPH
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Re: New Thunderbird ...wow
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Learned Hand
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Striking resemblance to a V-Rod (which just goes to show that bad taste ain't all on the other side of the pond). I like this bike less every time I see it.
'08 America Blue/White; Custom Headlamps, Custom Lowers, Clearview 20", Bafflectomy
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Re: New Thunderbird ...wow
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Loquacious
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that bike is growing on me more and more
Frank
(Former)05 BA tbike pipes, ai removed, Freak, mikuni hsr 42's, 904, ported/polished head, 1mm oversized valves
NOW-2010 silver and black tbird
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Re: New Thunderbird ...wow
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The V-Rod is the only H-D I'd consider-and I've had 4 Harley's. I like performance now and the V-Rod has it. So does my Rocket.
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Re: New Thunderbird ...wow
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Loquacious
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+1, everything but the V.
And you may see me tonight
With an illegal smile
J. Prine
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Re: New Thunderbird ...wow
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thanks for the pic's ..i belive there will be alot of speedy's and america's for sale and being trade in for the new thunderbird  once people get to set on one and take one for a test ride it will be all over... Ed 
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Re: New Thunderbird ...wow
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Learned Hand
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Quote:
Striking resemblance to a V-Rod
You've got to f'ing be kidding me, right? Please point out the slightest similarity to a V-Rod so I can understand your way of viewing the world 'cuz it is certainly foreign to me.
Ahh, yes, I see it now. NOT!
Ride On!
Airguy
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You gotta' be smart to be lazy(and get a job done)
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Re: New Thunderbird ...wow
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Saddle Sore
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Saddle Sore
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Quote:
Quote:
Striking resemblance to a V-Rod
You've got to f'ing be kidding me, right? Please point out the slightest similarity to a V-Rod so I can understand your way of viewing the world 'cuz it is certainly foreign to me.
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Re: New Thunderbird ...wow
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Fe Butt
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Fe Butt
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I'm guessin' some of the guys here think that if you'd look at just one of the cylinder heads and barrels of the V-Rod, then there is a similarity between the two bikes. They are talking about the motor of each more than they are anything else. Both are water-cooled, both have cam-end "eyes" along the top of the heads right where the "cooling fins" are, AND, the following, which I believe is the CRUCIAL similarity here....there are little or no cooling fins along the somewhat slab-sided (and in my view, which makes the engines somewhat boring looking) cylinder barrels on either of 'em, AND which makes the engine's top end look out of proportion and a little too large compared to where those pistons go up and down, up and down, up and down! And, ALSO making the engine look more modern and water-cooled...WHICH, once again in my view, makes ANY "Retro-styled" motorcycle...which the T-Bird IS...look, well, a little less "retro", read: AIR-COOLED!!! (but once again...other than THAT, I LIKE the looks of the T-Bird, especially that blue one, but...once again...yep....IT SHOULD HAVE HAD FINS ALONG THE FRICKEN CYLINDER BARRELS...well, more than those "attempts" at fins there, anyway!!!) 
Last edited by Dwight; 12/02/2008 4:52 PM.
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Re: New Thunderbird ...wow
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Loquacious
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Ya know, now that I look at it a little more, they MIGHT be right. Looks MORE like a big brother to the Lifan 250!
And you may see me tonight
With an illegal smile
J. Prine
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Re: New Thunderbird ...wow
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Quote:
Please point out the slightest similarity to a V-Rod
 
'08 America Blue/White; Custom Headlamps, Custom Lowers, Clearview 20", Bafflectomy
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Re: New Thunderbird ...wow
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Learned Hand
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Ahh, a similar design element at the top of the motor that is an artifact used to accentuate the technology facilitating placement of the dual cams. Yes, yes it is all clear to me now. It'll only be a matter of time until Triumph morphs that in to the v-twin. I see it all so clearly now. Thanks for the clarity.
I'm still buying one! (...and straight pipes will most likely be the first order of business, maybe. Need to see the bike to really make that decision. Didn't really like the look of them at first but now that I keep looking I am thinking the present pipes work pretty well with the lines of the bike. But I digress.)
Ride On!
Airguy
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You gotta' be smart to be lazy(and get a job done)
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Re: New Thunderbird ...wow
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Quote:
And, ALSO making the engine look more modern and water-cooled...
I would describe the look more as "car-like and clumsy." Unless the motor is really massive or you're making a Goldwing clone with everything shrouded, there's no reason to add the weight and complexity of water cooling. It ruins the styling, even if the designer's goal is a contemporary look. It's difficult to imagine how this bike will ever attract new buyers to Triumph. Wrong bike, wrong time, wrong style. Remember I said this and watch the sales figures over the next few years.
'08 America Blue/White; Custom Headlamps, Custom Lowers, Clearview 20", Bafflectomy
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Re: New Thunderbird ...wow
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Loquacious
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Thanks for the pics T_Twin.
It's indicative that those, like yourself, who have sat on it ... want it.
Including a lot who haven't.
Bedouin.
Blessed are those eyes that have seen more roads than any man! (Homer).
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Re: New Thunderbird ...wow
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Learned Hand
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It's difficult to imagine how this bike will ever attract new buyers to Triumph. Wrong bike, wrong time, wrong style. Remember I said this and watch the sales figures over the next few years.
i belive triumph will sell very well with this bike and with the rest of the line up also....
when talking with our local dealer's both have said they allready sold over hafe of the new Thunderbird there getting and come feb and march there will be waiting list..
so please don't say they won't sell...
and i rember all the negtive stuff being said about our bikes when they first came out..even before they hit the show room floor..
but they sold very well.. yes there was even a waiting list ..
these bike will do very well...and with a price of ....
$13000 to $14000 they will do very well...
ED
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Re: New Thunderbird ...wow
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Quote:
I would describe the look more as "car-like and clumsy." Unless the motor is really massive or you're making a Goldwing clone with everything shrouded, there's no reason to add the weight and complexity of water cooling.
Since all the motors on bikes need to go high efficiency combustion with low emissions because big brother seems to have enough of us convinced that our little engines are effecting the global climate, water-cooling has become a necessity. With water cooling we can squeeze more hp out of the motor for a given size since we can remove the heat more quickly and efficiently using water as compared to air. It is also partially for this reason that we can run higher compression ratios and such (i.e. greater heat generation) to get a more complete combustion of the fuel used. This is what big brother wants so we have no choice but to go this route.
By adding the water cooling jackets to the motor we increase it's bulk. Adding fins at this point would make it look like a slotted sta-puf marshmallow man. So, see the wave of the future brother; air cooled carbureted motors are a thing of the soon to be past.
Maybe you can put your engineering head to the problem so that we can have more efficient combustion using air cooling, and then put on your PR hat to convince people that you have truly solved that problem and then throw on your Lobbyist hat to convince all the Al Gore's of the world to change legislation to allow the manufacturers to produce and run your new design, of course after you put on your marketing hat and sell your design to said manufacturers.
Yep, would love to be purist and stay with the air cooled motors too. Just ain't gonna happen in today's political and PC climate so bike manufacturer's gotta do what they gotta do to keep the do-gooders happy and such. That being said, I think Triumph did a marvelous job of keeping a lot of the key design elements from the classic air cooled twin while incorporating design and functional elements to make a working modern parallel twin motor that the Al Gore's of this world will still grudgingly let them sell. This isn't change just to tick you off. This is change mandated by the eco-nazis put in place by the geniuses we all elect to public office. I give Triumph a lot of credit for a new design for a parallel twin motor incorporating all this psychotic legislation. I know change sometimes hurts. You'll get used to it.
Ride On!
Airguy
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You gotta' be smart to be lazy(and get a job done)
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Re: New Thunderbird ...wow
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Re: New Thunderbird ...wow
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Fe Butt
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I perfectly understand what you're saying here, Keith. Yep! I sure do. I perfectly understand that most, if not all, motorcycle engines will in the future have to be water-cooled in order to meet federal, state, AND international emission standards. Yes I do, and I've known this fact for some time now. BUT, do me a favor here. Look at this pic of one of the engines of the first generation Hinckley T-Bird Triples here if you will and tell me....  ...WHY is it that the Triumph engineers and designers placed those [basically] non-functional cooling fins under the cylinder heads and around the cylinder barrels on this WATER-COOLED creation of theirs, and YET went with the more slab-sided, and yes, BLAND look on their next generation Thunderbird RETRO-styled motorcycle engine? You HAVE to know the reason those designers added those fins on the original Hinckley T-Birds was for AESTHETIC reasons only, don't cha??? And I'm guessin' the boys in Hinckley at the time KNEW that was because a SLAB-SIDED look on any engine that sticks out for all the world to see, and is not hidden behind plastic or under an automobile's hood(as Jack above mentioned), just natually adds more "visual interest" with...and here it comes.......COOLING FINS!!! (and if anybody out there is wondering why in the world this seemingly "minor point of interest" seems to be an obsession of mine here...it's because....I LIKE EVERYTHING ELSE ABOUT THE NEW T-BIRD...the size, the potential power, AND of course that it's a Triumph Parallel Twin...BUT THAT ENGINE IS JUST NOT THAT PRETTY TO LOOK AT, and I just don't see me sittin' in my garage with a beer in my hand and lookin' over at IT and admiring its engine's beauty while its just sittin' there like I can presently with my BONNIE AMERICA'S MOTOR!...and I wanted the new T-Bird to be JUST AS GORGEOUS so I could do the SAME FRIGGIN' THING OCCASSIONALLY....that's why, folks!!!)
Last edited by Dwight; 12/03/2008 3:22 PM.
Yep! Just like a good Single Malt Scotch, you might call me "an acquired taste" TOO.(among the many OTHER things you may care to call me, of course)
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Re: New Thunderbird ...wow
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Freelance Jedi Knight
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Freelance Jedi Knight
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Quote:
I'm still buying one! (...and straight pipes will most likely be the first order of business, maybe. Need to see the bike to really make that decision. Didn't really like the look of them at first but now that I keep looking I am thinking the present pipes work pretty well with the lines of the bike. But I digress.)
the reason of upswept pipes in my opinion is smaller clearance than our bikes and wider engine....test rider told me that its very easy to scrap footpegs on new thunderbird and with straight pipes...pipes will go very first 
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Re: New Thunderbird ...wow
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Freelance Jedi Knight
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Freelance Jedi Knight
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Quote:
Quote:
Please point out the slightest similarity to a V-Rod
"good argument" I would go further new thunderbird has TWO wheels and THIS is similar to any other bike on the market
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Re: New Thunderbird ...wow
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Learned Hand
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Learned Hand
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Quote:
Quote:
It's difficult to imagine how this bike will ever attract new buyers to Triumph. Wrong bike, wrong time, wrong style. Remember I said this and watch the sales figures over the next few years.
i belive triumph will sell very well with this bike and with the rest of the line up also....
when talking with our local dealer's both have said they allready sold over hafe of the new Thunderbird there getting and come feb and march there will be waiting list..
so please don't say they won't sell...
What are the actual sales numbers and demographics of those buyers? Are the numbers of any real significance in the context of national sales of motorcycles? And how many of those buyers are ex-HD/Honda/Kawa riders "moving over," rather than current or ex-Triumph riders "moving up"?
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and i rember all the negtive stuff being said about our bikes when they first came out..even before they hit the show room floor..
Not by me. The styling of the Bonneville line ("original" and America/Speedmaster) is exactly what the market wanted as alternatives. That's the reason Triumph sales have grown so well. This merely points out the apparent disconnect between many long-time Triumph aficionados and market reality.
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but they sold very well.. yes there was even a waiting list ..
Yet, in real numbers, Triumph holds only a razor-thin slice of the market. The Thunderbird won't change that, and in fact, development of this machine in deference to one more broadly marketable will cost Triumph additional share. I'll go a step further by predicting that the process will accelerate due the current economic crisis. Rather than pushing aside its competition, the Thunderbird may very well be destined to a legacy not unlike the Edsel.
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Re: New Thunderbird ...wow
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Fe Butt
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Fe Butt
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EDSEL???!!! Well, I suppose if you squint REAL HARD that there radiator on the new Thunderbird COULD look like it's an "Oldsmobile sucking a lemon", I guess!!! (...as they used to say about that particular old Ford sales dud!) I don't know Jack. I'm thinkin' you might not like this new bike much, huh?! Well, like I said...I generally DO like the looks of it, BUT guess which part of it I wish I would have had a "little hand" in helpin' them boys there in Hinckley design, HUH?! (I'll give ya only THREE guesses...and the first two don't count!)  
Last edited by Dwight; 12/03/2008 3:57 PM.
Yep! Just like a good Single Malt Scotch, you might call me "an acquired taste" TOO.(among the many OTHER things you may care to call me, of course)
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Re: New Thunderbird ...wow
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Dwight, Yep, good idea on their part to put those there. It is a bit different of a playing field though being that the 3 cylinder 900's cylinders have just a smidge smaller foot print than those 2 1600's cylinders. Not sure what the 900's cylinder diameter is but I am going to guess on the order of 1/2 that of the 1600's. I really think this is a space thing. I bet they tried the fins on those and the base of the motor probably turned out looking more like the Marina Towers in Chicago, than a classic Triumph parallel twin motor. 
Ride On!
Airguy
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You gotta' be smart to be lazy(and get a job done)
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Re: New Thunderbird ...wow
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Fe Butt
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Fe Butt
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HEY!!! Whatcha talkin' 'bout here, Keith!!! If those towers were good enough for BOB NEWHART, then BY GAWD they're good enough for ME!!!  (that WAS where he and Emily lived, wasn't it?!) Sorry dude, but I don't see the correlative design element in regard to a motorcycle engine there. (I'm gonna have to throw the flag on ya and give ya a 15 yard penalty for "reaching" here)
Yep! Just like a good Single Malt Scotch, you might call me "an acquired taste" TOO.(among the many OTHER things you may care to call me, of course)
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Re: New Thunderbird ...wow
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The point being that what you are asking for is two very large cylinders to have fins around them, say for instance like two hideous architectural elements in aforementioned city, and then trying to compare that to an in line triple motor design that has fins place over the box. Apples and oranges baby. The flag has been picked up and vigorously replaced in the faux officials pie hole!  And yes, that is where Bob and Emily lived.
Ride On!
Airguy
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You gotta' be smart to be lazy(and get a job done)
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Re: New Thunderbird ...wow
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Fe Butt
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Fe Butt
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So Keith, you're sayin' that instead of those two iconic towers, you'd rather have the skyline of the Windy City sportin' two slab-sided cylindical monstosities, would ya?!  YUCK!!!  And, without those balconies where exactly would that foxy brunette Suzanne Pleshette have stood as the camera slowly zeroed in on that beautiful face o' hers as she waited patiently for that psychologist husband o' hers to come home from the office, HUH?! Tell me, WHERE??? (sorry dude, but I think ONLY a person such as one of Bob's patients, the cynical Mr.Carlin, would have agreed with you here!!!)
Yep! Just like a good Single Malt Scotch, you might call me "an acquired taste" TOO.(among the many OTHER things you may care to call me, of course)
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Re: New Thunderbird ...wow
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Learned Hand
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So T_TWIN, tell us what it was like to sit on it! 
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Re: New Thunderbird ...wow
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Fe Butt
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Fe Butt
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Quote:
So T_TWIN, tell us what it was like to sit on it!
"Sit on it!"??? 
Hey Eddy!!! We were discussing "The Bob Newhart Show" here...NOT "HAPPY DAYS"!!!!
Come on dude!!! Get with the (proper) program here, WILL YA???!!!) 
Yep! Just like a good Single Malt Scotch, you might call me "an acquired taste" TOO.(among the many OTHER things you may care to call me, of course)
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Re: New Thunderbird ...wow
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Loquacious
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Loquacious
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Ah yes, The old "Boxers or Briefs" argument comes to mind! Who gives a sh-t! If ya like it, buy it! If ya don't, shake your head and shut up! (I did )
And you may see me tonight
With an illegal smile
J. Prine
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Re: New Thunderbird ...wow
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Adjunct
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That Victory vision is the ugliest thig since the Honda Rune
"Got the wind in my face the road goes on for miles...."
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Re: New Thunderbird ...wow
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Fe Butt
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Fe Butt
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Quote:
Ah yes, The old "Boxers or Briefs" argument comes to mind!
Who gives a sh-t! If ya like it, buy it!
If ya don't, shake your head and shut up! (I did )
So, ah, erle. Are you sayin' that this discussion has...ahem..."jumped the shark" then???
(I'm tellin' ya, I'll sidetrack this friggin' thread into the topic of '70s sitcoms if its the last thing I do, boy!!!)
Yep! Just like a good Single Malt Scotch, you might call me "an acquired taste" TOO.(among the many OTHER things you may care to call me, of course)
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Re: New Thunderbird ...wow
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Learned Hand
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Learned Hand
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Quote:
...you'd rather have the skyline of the Windy City sportin' two slab-sided cylindical monstosities, would ya?!
Count me in, especially if the skyline also sports the world's largest heat exchanger! What with all the wind up there, that would be enough to cool 20 ugly bikes.
'08 America Blue/White; Custom Headlamps, Custom Lowers, Clearview 20", Bafflectomy
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Re: New Thunderbird ...wow
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Loquacious
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Loquacious
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Quote:
With water cooling we can squeeze more hp out of the motor for a given size since we can remove the heat more quickly and efficiently using water as compared to air. It is also partially for this reason that we can run higher compression ratios and such (i.e. greater heat generation) to get a more complete combustion of the fuel used. This is what big brother wants so we have no choice but to go this route.
Keith,
I agree and if I may add to this I would think that Triumph would be looking at some decent performance with that size engine - unlike the current air-cooled elephants with a similar displacement.
Look at the water-cooled 800cc P-Twin Beemer (Rotax) engine 83 HP compared to our (the new EFI 865cc) engines at 62?
I would think that the Triumph boys already know their market share and have their reasons for producing this bike.
The same goes for user demographics - I don't think they need any arm-chair "experts" to analyze them for them.
As for the naysayers ...
Some don't like it. (I do)
Some like it but don't have a use for it (I have).
Some cannot afford it. (I can)
Some have a "wifey" who won't let them have it so they make every excuse they can (mostly by bad-mouthing it). (No comment)
Some have a "momma" who won't let them have it so they make every excuse they can (mostly by bad-mouthing it). (My "momma" has always found something positive to say about each of my circa. 40 bikes (in my time), even when at 68 she got her leg burnt by the exhaust).
Some like it and do have a use for it. I do, long distances come to mind, as I find the SM a little inadequate (even though I have taken it to 25 countries in the last 17 months).
Some just plain like it. (see above).
As for the styling ... I guess it's different strokes for different folks.
Bedouin.
Blessed are those eyes that have seen more roads than any man! (Homer).
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Re: New Thunderbird ...wow
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Fe Butt
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Fe Butt
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Quote:
As for the styling ... I guess it's different strokes for different folks.
Oh great!!! Now we've gone from '70s sitcoms to late '60s Sly and the Family Stone anthems!!!
Well, like I said before here, this new T-Bird IS "retro", and so I suppose that's fitting alright!
(BTW T-Man...like you ALSO said above, Judie says it's a good thing I'm not completely sold on the T-Bird's looks, because, well, like you said above......)
Yep! Just like a good Single Malt Scotch, you might call me "an acquired taste" TOO.(among the many OTHER things you may care to call me, of course)
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Re: New Thunderbird ...wow
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Bar Shake
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Bar Shake
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Well, Looking at the engine closer, I'm sure there would be room for some vestigial faux fins. But look at it this way, that smooth area would be a cool place for a fasteddy sticker. (Now you know who really has an "in" with Hinckley )
Contra todo mal, mezcal; contra todo bien, también
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Re: New Thunderbird ...wow
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Saddle Sore
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Saddle Sore
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Thanks for the pix, Phil.
I still like this bike. If it wasn't for the economy being what it is and the ever-present possibility of losing my job, I'd have my name on my dealer's sign-up sheet.
I'd never sell my America though....
More flags
More fun!
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Re: New Thunderbird ...wow
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Joined: Apr 2006
Posts: 2,623 Likes: 2
Loquacious
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Loquacious
Joined: Apr 2006
Posts: 2,623 Likes: 2 |
Quote:
That Victory vision is the ugliest thig since the Honda Rune
Yes, it's been a huge disappointment. Fast, agile and comfortable for the long haul.
My dealer has only sold 3. In the past week. 
Kevin - Luceo Non Uro
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Re: New Thunderbird ...wow
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Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 1,438
Learned Hand
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Learned Hand
Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 1,438 |
Quote:
Yes, it's been a huge disappointment. Fast, agile and comfortable for the long haul.
No comments were made in the disappointment or performance departments. Just that is is a fugly machine. Straightforward and simple fall through the ugly tree for that thing. That being said, all I have read about its performance have been very positive. Still fugly!
Ride On!
Airguy
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You gotta' be smart to be lazy(and get a job done)
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