Bonneville America Forums Forums Technical Forums Performance Mods Drop-in K&N Filter (Non-FREAK)

Question for the class:

Anybody try the new drop-in K&N filter? NewSpeedmaster.com has 'em here:

http://www.newspeedmaster.com/html/k_and_n_air_filter.html

Experiences? Comments? Better/worse than the FREAK?

--Jaeger

Don't have one but have a UNI. I do however have an opinion i think has some validity. The stock filter's "screen", or the metal surround obviously inhibits the amount of air that can get to the element itself. So no matter how well the paper element itself can flow air, the metal screen inhibits it by only allowing a certain amount of air to get to the element. Look at it and you'll notice it probably only leaves 50% of the area covering the element open. Something i've yet to see mentioned but is obviously a big consideration. The UNI has a screen that is like a chain link fence and probably leaves a good 75% of the area open to airflow if not more. The K&n from what i can tell from the pics has no screen at all which i believe would allow more flow than either. However, from what i've gathered about the K%N it also allows larger prticles to pass. Therefore i bought the UNI figuring that from what i've read it's element traps smaller particles than the K%N and the screen covers a pretty small area that is probably negligable as far as air flow.

the point is that no matter how good a filter's ability to flow air is, the screen can inhibit it no matter how good it is. In my mind the UNI traps smaller particles but allows air flow good access to the element due to the screen. the K%N allows more due to no screen but also supposedly allows larger particles that from what i've read seems to be detremental.

2 things to consaider from what i've said.....
1)- the particle size thats allowed thru the various filters as i've stated is not fact, but just the general consensus i've gotten by reading a lot on the subject. I may be wrong

2)-the screens.....this is fact. the Uni is much more open than stock, and the K&N is more open than both, assuming that there is no screen, which i get from looking at the pics on brent's site. But it could be a fine mesh that the pic doesn't reveal so i'm not 100% sure.

In any case, i felt the UNI was the best compromise between an open screen and filter element ability to trap small particulates. but again the element's ability to do that is just my feeling from all i've read. But i feel good about my UNi. It did give me a boost and allowed me to jet richer and get even more power. If the K%N gives a bit more i don't care because i feel i'm safer with the UNI.

We use to run K&N filters on our off road cars. If they're good for the Baja 500 and 1000 then their more than good enough for our bikes on the road.
I personally run a modified Uni filter and like it. I don't believe the wire chain mesh inhibits air flow to any degree measurable.
The Uni and K&N are both top of the line for aftermarket filters.

I haven't tried it yet and I don't have the freak,, but 1 K&N filter in a restrictive airbox cannot hope to equal the airflow of the Freak with a K&N lashed to each carb.

You may get some improved performance, but the Freak maximizes the airflow. Once you apply performance exhaust (outflow) and proper jetting (fuel/air ratio), you are there.... The engine will breathe as well as it can, next step, bigger lungs....

i am ging to try the K&N and drill the bottom of the box. already have great pipes so i iwll let you know the difference when i do it

Frank

I got the first K&N that Brent sold ,according to him.I find no seat of the pants difference in the way my America preforms.If that is your reason for buying one save your money and stay with a sock filter.

The filter alone won't get you much if any performamnce. It's the jetting that does. The filter just allows you to jet richer. So put one in and you'll feel the difference, but not till you up the jetting. I'm jetted way richer in the needles than the bike would allow with the stock intake amout or even near it. I've tried to add intake flow in the past with leaner jetting than i have now and the bike just stumbled.

I asked the question because I've done all the jetting I can do for now with the stock air setup; I'm running 130/45s (finally checked), TOR longs with a snorkelectomy... I'm stuck with what more to do without mucking with the O2 end of things, but I don't have the $300 to drop on a Freak anytime soon.

This question comes on the heels of my buddy doing a NARC on his Bonnie, where he dropped 150/49s in the carbs, and I suddeny became wildly jealous.

--Jaeger

Well then why not go for the max mods you can....get a filter, drill the airbox and filter bottom and rejet. You'll get a good bit more. I can tell you that theres a healthy difference between my bike how it was with the stock filter and no drilled airbox and how it is now after i did those 2 things and rejetted for them, mainly the needles. It brought the acelleration up to where i was finally happy with it. I used the UNI filter tho. From all i've read it seems as tho it's better at trapping particles and still flows much better than stock.

I'm just nervous about punching holes in the airbox that close to the rear tire — that just seems like a really good way to blow a lot of crap and water into the filter. Believe me, I was sitting there looking at the drill and thinking about it, but... just makes me a little oogie. Besides, can't really undo that one. :P

Anybody have any problems with punching holes in the airbox?

--Jaeger

never heard of a problem, planing on doing it myself to. wouldnt worrie about it to much if i were you

Frank

Hahahah!! Oh, DUH -- you're in L.A.! No, I guess rain isn't a big problem for ya.

But you don't have problems with other crap gettin gin the filter? Hrm. That does make it more promising, I suppose... Still nervous about the water, tho.

--Jaeger

You can always do like I did, I drilled the hole in the filter and the bottom of the airbox with a 1 3/8" hole saw.

I didn't see a whole lot of improvement, so I installed a button plug in the hole in the airbox....

Hrm. Also a good idea. I like the possibility of plugging the hole fairly easily.

Here's a thought -- has anyone tried running a ram-air pipe into the stock airbox? Something like an air scoop on the outside of the case to try to drive more air into the filter? I don't quite know how do do it "nicely," but I figure it was worth asking...

--Jaeger

The problem I have had with the UNI is because it is not a pleated filter it has far less surface area than the stock filter or the K&N. Because of this I have to clean the thing ALOT. As soon as the surface gets covered with dust performance drops off rapidly. The pleated filters, besides having more than 3 times the surface area, will trap the dirt in the valleys first leaving the peaks cleaner to let more air flow past. I'll be getting a K&N this winter.

ikj,

I'm already running 130 mains, Thunderbike longs, TBS needles, and snorkel out. The bike's running good as it is and the plugs are a medium brown color. The drilled holes didn't seem to make a difference (s-o-p) in performance, but they did cause my air filter to get dirty a lot quicker.
I blame that on where I work as we have a lot of dust and dirt there. So I elected to put the button plug in the air box. I bent all the tangs out a bit to make sure I got a real tight fit, as I put it in from the outside - bottom of the air box.

I put the K&N drop in filter last night and so far it seems to run much better, even in this cold & damp weather we are having. Now all I have to do is save up for the Thunderbike Pipes!

Martyn -- thanks for the update! I'm really curious to see how folks react to the new filter, as I want to upgrade the air system without doing anything expensive and/or irreperable.

Please give an update once you put a couple hundred miles on it!

--Jaeger

Hi Jaeger

Just got back from a round trip of 580 miles & IMHO the K&N filter has definately improved the performance. The throttle seems more responsive, today at 90mph, fully loaded it was still pulling going up a drag

Now all I have to do is cut out the baffles in the spare pair of silencers I got off ebay & it will sound as good as it looks

The more I ride this bike, the more I love it

I have used K&N filters religiously in my vehicles since the beginning of recorded time. There has never been a negative result from their use. Right now I just have the drop in, but am looking at making a modified Freak set-up this winter. The Freak costs so much that it has given me some MAJOR motivation to fab my own setup. Should be a lot of fun:-)

I'm certainly no expert. But one thing i can say thru experience in jetting my bike till it was at it's best is this. To those who say a uni or K&N or even a drilled bottom did nothing for them, that doesn't mean they didn't increase airflow. Whether or not you can feel a difference depends on where your jetting is at the moment that you try it. You're adding more airflow, so if it's already on the lean side you'll feel anywhere from noting to the bike running ragged and even stumbling. If it's a bit rich to begin with you'll then feel the difference.so if you felt nothing chances are you would have if you threw a shim on or got smaller needles, while if you did that w/o adding the filter the bike may have been too rich. It's a balancing act and you can't just add one thing w/o adding a balance of the other, IE:fuel vs air.

Thats just a basic theory that is more complicated than just that. But thats what i find when playing with my intake and jetting. When i installed my UNI i felt a difference. Not big, but there none the less.

Martyn and/or I.K.Johnny--

Have you messed with the carbs yet? If so, what're you using? If I'm correct, My current setup of 130/45s, +2 shims will be too lean for the airbox... or will it?

Gurus, have ye input?

--Jaeger

I.K.Johnny --

Good guess! Yes, I have TOR long pipes and the snorks out -- and right now she's running very nicely. I'm just wondering what I can do to squeeze a bit more out of her without doing a full FREAK, as I don't have the dollars.

--Jaeger

Hi Jaeger

I have the standard original pipes, A1 removed & standard jets with the K&N & standard airbox configuration it runs great throughout the range and I am getting a better fuel consumption! . I will play around with the jets when I change the pipes.

Interesting. I've never heard the TORs are more restrictive than, say D&D, but I suppose that makes sense given that they aren't as loud either... Dunno. I'm not complaining -- my bike came from the dealer with teh TORs, so I'm a happy camper either way.

Once I get my holiday bonus and hopefully have a few dollars left over, I'll get one of the K&N drop-ins and see how she does. I'm fairly certain that now she's running a littel rich, soooo... need to let her get a little more oxygen.

--Jaeger

jaeger, i run the open at both ends airbox and open uni filter and have no compunction running rain sleet or what ever. the s.o.p. preformance was immeditely noticed (132/45/2;modified first gen tor's) (i want to try different needles(thruxton?) and drilling the slide(?) for throttle response) however, as mentioned before the filter gets dirty quickly and when she's dirty the tuning goes south. makes sense as you tune with a nicely oiled clean filter and a few weeks later she's gummed up. i am happy with the results even with the added chore of staying on top of the filter cleaning. better yet tune with a dirty filter and you'll happy at least 50% of the time!!!!!!!!!

I just bought the K&N drop-in filter and immediately voided the "Million Mile" warranty by opening the other side partially to accomodate my drilled air-box mod. I noted on the instruction sheet to oil the filter every 50,000/100,000 miles unless operating under extremely dusty conditions. I sent a quick email off to K&N for verification, but does this sound right?

I clean and re-oil every year on all my vehicles and have done so forever.

The filters would be positively filthy after the recommended mileage.

Thanks Phil, that makes perfect sense.

.... while I'm at it, do you use K&N's recharging product, or have you found a cost effective alternative?

I use the K&N stuff. I can usually get 3 cleanings/charges out of one kit. I think I paid about $10 for the kit.