 Re: Army Living
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Joined: Jan 2005
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Loquacious
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Loquacious
Joined: Jan 2005
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Quote:
Perhaps. It is true that CNN can be relied upon to blow out of proprotion stories
Apparently, that bastion of liberal ideology, FOX, has jumped on the bandwagon too....
Barracks Story
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Re: Army Living
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Joined: Jun 2006
Posts: 1,026
Learned Hand
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Learned Hand
Joined: Jun 2006
Posts: 1,026 |
CNN is anti military, all the way. They search for this type of stuff to run. Too bad they find it and ignore other things that contribute to some of the facility issues.
In the 90s, under the Clinton admin, they shuffled around commands ( it also is happening with this admin, as it seems to with many of them. Its just a matter of to what degree ). They moved one command from Rock Island, Il to Huntsville, AL., they had to build all new buildings and spend a bunch to relocate. Then, to make room, they moved the MP command/training from Huntville, AL to Fort Leonard Wood, in MO. This cost a lot again, I got the mega contract to supply a million and half sq ft of insulation. They then moved another command elsewhere. And so on. This just spent up a bunch of money and pork barreled a bunch of areas.
In this case, these barracks shown were set to be replaced, part of the shuffle game, but with a timetable miscalculation, it looks bad.It will be made right. But will the wasteful spending be corrected and be used to get us the desperately needed new weapons systems and supplies?
Our Liberties We Prize and Our Rights We Will Maintain
If a nation expects to be ignorant and free, in a state of civilization, it expects what never was and will never be.----Thomas Jefferson
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Re: Army Living
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Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 3,954
Loquacious
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Loquacious
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per the Army, these barracks are due for demolition in 2013, that's a 5 year "miscalculation"....
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Re: Army Living
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Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 1,933 Likes: 3
Learned Hand
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Learned Hand
Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 1,933 Likes: 3 |
I have to admit I only looked at the one photo from the link Ian posted and the topic of the heading when what struck me in that picture was not disarray but a specific problem. I got distracted while in the middle of "doing my home work" by a phone call from a site member.
I think..that some of the point is not the reporting but the way the media often reports to sensationalize rather than highlight or draw attention to things. Too often it's about vilifying a particular person or group rather than a true interest in any problem real or perceived. I am not drawing favor to or absolving any network of doing a good or poor job in reporting. Sensationalism sells and they all do it.
There are many issues. I would say sorry for chiming in but I have missed my participation in the reasonable and respectful banter that this place so often has to offer. I have been too busy and missed and important part of this forum. Now Dwight answer you phone so I can pick on you!
Last edited by Fasteddy; 04/29/2008 9:47 PM.
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Re: Army Living
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Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 6,821
Bar Shake
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Bar Shake
Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 6,821 |
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I never meant to knock the military or the country I love and am proud to be a citizen of.
Well then Ian, if that's the case, you should never commit the high heresy of suggesting that there is anything about certain sacred institutions that can be improved.
That's a sure trip to the rack.
Or maybe some "re-education" time.
Contra todo mal, mezcal; contra todo bien, también
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Re: Army Living
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Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 6,821
Bar Shake
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Bar Shake
Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 6,821 |
Quote:
I think..that some of the point is not the reporting but the way the media often reports to sensationalize rather than highlight or draw attention to things. Too often it's about vilifying a particular person or group rather than a true interest in any problem real or perceived. I am not drawing favor to or absolving any network of doing a good or poor job in reporting. Sensationalism sells and they all do it.
Now Eddy, don't be too hard on the media. They're just businesses trying to sell beer, soda pop, and feminine hygiene products.
They've never been about news. Just attracting sponsors.
Sensationalism sells.
It's the very heart of commerce.
Contra todo mal, mezcal; contra todo bien, también
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Re: Army Living
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Joined: Feb 2007
Posts: 23,217 Likes: 61
Fe Butt
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OP
Fe Butt
Joined: Feb 2007
Posts: 23,217 Likes: 61 |
No re-education needed here but maybe for the blind who won't admit a problem right in front of their faces.
I learned all I need to know about life by killing smart people and eating their brains.
Eat right ,Exercise ,Stay fit, Die Anyway!
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Re: Army Living
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Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 6,821
Bar Shake
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Bar Shake
Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 6,821 |
Quote:
No re-education needed here but maybe for the blind who won't admit a problem right in front of their faces.
Contra todo mal, mezcal; contra todo bien, también
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Re: Army Living
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Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 2,527
Loquacious
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Loquacious
Joined: Mar 2006
Posts: 2,527 |
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No Eddy they showed many more pictures on the TV broadcast. The bathroom flooding is only 1 of many problems with that building. I never meant to knock the military or the country I love and am proud to be a citizen of. Just that that building should not have been housing anyone. There are sewage lines that come up into living quarters that have tissue stuffed in them to keep sewage gases out among other problems. Hardships are fine and to be expected in the field but not at Ft Bragg. Thats state side and should at the very least be livable. I am happy the service men here say it's the exception rather than the rule but in my opinion it shouldn't be at all in the US borders , just as Walter Reed shouldn't have been in the condition it was in either.
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One thing that many uninitiated non former miltary people dont comprehend about the Military is this.....
All the branches of the service are huge bureacratic machines that do there best to operate by the book so to speak. Every action and task in the military from minor to major is governed by bureacracy that is all encompassing and deeper than the darkest well. This is not as I see it a good thing because the paperwork and details needed at times to get something accomplished are ridiculous. But it seems based on history , tradition and based on the need to keep good order and discipline that no one has ever figured out how to streamline chains of command. As all of us know who have served the greater good of the many outweighs the needs of the few and its not our business to question how things are done or get done.
Having been in the military I know this in detail and having worked in govt contracting supplying parts to Naval support facilities I see them suffering from the same broken bureacracy failings that slow processes, create mistakes where none exist and maintain jobs for govt employees.
As much as I appreciate the US military the same bureacracy can exist within it. Bureacracy makes the system break down in small locales at times.
The US army is one large Green Machine. For anyone to think it will operate fully flawlessly at all levels of detail all the time is a mistake
Stuff happens as it does everywhere and there is no reason to assume that perfection exists just because its the US Army and runs on discipline and good order.
Even the US Marines screw up and have "problems"
I beleive this issue was nothing more than a bureacracy failure and is a rare exception as I have stated.
I am not sure we are hearing the entire story anyway. We are hearing what CNN wanted us to here so that some young correspondent can make a name for himself with cheap sensationalism.
The whole detailed story is not being told. For instance all that one soldier living in that barrack would need to do is walk over to the Post IG office and ask some questions and action most certainly would be forthcoming as a result of that.
And Ian no one was ascribing any lack of patriotism or concern on your part.
Granted I would not have considered this item post worthy but thats because I have experience with and fully understand the depth and or lack of depth associated with it.
Here is what will happen as a result of this story. Perhaps a little faster than had it not been sensationalized.
A senior NCO or an officer somewhere in the chain of command that falls within the bueracratic chain of responsibility for that barrack will be discipled and their military career will be ended for the purpose of promotion.
It might even be a sacrificial lamb who really is not responsible or did not drop the ball directly but happens to be in the wrong locale at the wrong time.
Someone senior to that lamb will have his career go on uneventfully.
Thats the way the military works.
"Proud to be an Infidel" ... "100% pure American Jingoist"
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Re: Army Living
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Joined: Jun 2007
Posts: 529
Adjunct
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Adjunct
Joined: Jun 2007
Posts: 529 |
It's all about money. If we're spending tons on bullets, somethings got to give. I remember when I was going through submarine school in the early 90's there was one particular barracks that was condemned no less than 3 times. Whenever the student population got too big, the navy would waiver the building so sailors could live there. Once the population subsided, the building was recondemned. Pretty sad. Not in anyway saying it's right, but it is what it is.
2005 America, green/gray, gutted stock pipes, tall sissy bar w/ luggage rack, Saddleman's dual touring seat and Tourmaster saddlebags (and sissybar bag).
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Re: Army Living
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Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 20,096 Likes: 2
Fe Butt
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Fe Butt
Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 20,096 Likes: 2 |
Well Kevin, If you would have posted this very well worded above response INITIALLY, instead of your "indictment" of the news source responsible for the exposure of this situation and your on-going rants about "Hollywood", then I'd guess this thread would probably be about a quarter of it's present length. (but THAT'S just a guess, ya know)
Yep! Just like a good Single Malt Scotch, you might call me "an acquired taste" TOO.(among the many OTHER things you may care to call me, of course)
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Re: Army Living
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Joined: Feb 2007
Posts: 23,217 Likes: 61
Fe Butt
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OP
Fe Butt
Joined: Feb 2007
Posts: 23,217 Likes: 61 |
Quote:
its not our business to question how things are done or get done.
I disagree with this part of your last post Kevin, if not our job then who's? The military supposedly works for the American people and our interests. I think it is our duty to keep tabs and checks on what is being done by them and how the men and women in service are being treated.Other than that I pretty much agree with the rest of what you say. The soldiers are adults and should complain to who ever it is they are supposed to complain to. As you say however the bureaucratic mess may not get things done and then needs to be brought tp the public eye, for some reason then things get done. There was a military spokes person on this morning saying that things will be fixed right away and the conditions were uncalled for. They also stated new quarters were being built as stated above in this thread. Not sure of the rank of the spokes person but he was some kind of officer. He talked about the difficult conditions over seas and stated there was no excuse for them to come home to those conditions.
EDIT: The guy was some general, just caught part of it again.
Last edited by The_Dog33; 04/30/2008 1:34 PM.
I learned all I need to know about life by killing smart people and eating their brains.
Eat right ,Exercise ,Stay fit, Die Anyway!
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Re: Army Living
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Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 3,954
Loquacious
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Loquacious
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Dupre, not to sidetrack the post, but when were you there, and what boat were you on? I was there from '86-91, and on the Augusta (710). And the barracks were fine when I was there, it must've been someone from your class that mucked them up.... 
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Re: Army Living
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Joined: Jun 2007
Posts: 529
Adjunct
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Adjunct
Joined: Jun 2007
Posts: 529 |
I got to Groton in early '92. The barracks I was talking about was building 150 right up the hill right behind the main SUBSCOL building. I was there a year and a half before getting attached to the BOSTON (SSN 703) on the waterfront. Holy cow that was soooo long ago now. Thanks a lot! LOL
2005 America, green/gray, gutted stock pipes, tall sissy bar w/ luggage rack, Saddleman's dual touring seat and Tourmaster saddlebags (and sissybar bag).
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Re: Army Living
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Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 3,954
Loquacious
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Loquacious
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Yeah, I seem to recall that building. I started out in the barracks over by the PX (over in that corner of the base toward Rt. 12, then went over to those long barracks against the fence next to Rt. 12 during Subschool, and then finally to the ones on top of the hill by the Hospital. By that time I was dating my wife and living WAY off base up in Columbia CT and commuting in to the boat each day (except duty days of course).
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