 TBS needles installed, but high idle speed and...
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Joined: Jul 2005
Posts: 51
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TBS needles with two shims, idles at abt 1800 rpm now,with idle screw all out, more popping on decel. NO need for choke either, too rich? Which adjustment should I be making first to correct this. Otherwise, she just flys now  through the rpm range. Nice addition. cheers Don
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Don
04 BA,TBike pipes,AI,FREAK-150 mains,TBS,42 pilot, 3 turns,\progressive fr and rr shocks, 18T,and lotsa chrome
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Re: TBS needles installed, but high idle speed and
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Joined: Jul 2006
Posts: 1,337
Learned Hand
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Learned Hand
Joined: Jul 2006
Posts: 1,337 |
TBS w/ 2 shims is a lot. The needles (and shims) have the most dramatic impart of the fuel delivery at mid throttle. I'm running TBS with no shims. I was using stock w/2 shims.
Exhaust pops on decel "usually" are from a lean condition- either from jetting or a leak in the exhaust system introducing atmospheric back flow (fresh air).
What size pilot are you running?
2002 Bandit 1200/ GSXR cams/ 1277 BB Kit/ Holeshot header and can/ 38mm flatslides/ a good head/lotsa hp/lotsa tq- lots of rear tires...
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Re: TBS needles installed, but high idle speed and
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Joined: Nov 2006
Posts: 1,302
Learned Hand
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Learned Hand
Joined: Nov 2006
Posts: 1,302 |
Possibly a vacuum leak will cause a high idle and some lean popping. ensure the diaphrams are not wrinkled and the rubber caps are good.
mike
2006 neon blue speedmaster
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Re: TBS needles installed, but high idle speed and
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Joined: Jul 2005
Posts: 51
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Don
04 BA,TBike pipes,AI,FREAK-150 mains,TBS,42 pilot, 3 turns,\progressive fr and rr shocks, 18T,and lotsa chrome
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Re: TBS needles installed, but high idle speed and...
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Joined: Feb 2006
Posts: 3,099
Loquacious
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Loquacious
Joined: Feb 2006
Posts: 3,099 |
Don,
Did you take a look at our dyno results from NH?
And have you seen Pat's jetting calculator?
I'm no expert, but I don't think the TBS needles need shims.
Certainly not two. I'm running 1 shim w/stock needles.
UNI filter, 45/135, and BUBs. 65.3rwhp, 50ft/lbs torque.
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Re: TBS needles installed, but high idle speed and
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Joined: Jul 2006
Posts: 1,337
Learned Hand
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Learned Hand
Joined: Jul 2006
Posts: 1,337 |
Move to 45 pilots for the popping, check for leaks on the little rubber vacuum caps, at the header flange to the head, and the slip on joint and take out the shims. Balance and sync the carbs. Get a dyno and go from there.
The 45 will help your idle circuit, the TBS's will take out that mid throttle dip.
2002 Bandit 1200/ GSXR cams/ 1277 BB Kit/ Holeshot header and can/ 38mm flatslides/ a good head/lotsa hp/lotsa tq- lots of rear tires...
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Re: TBS needles installed, but high idle speed and
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Joined: Jun 2007
Posts: 111
Adjunct
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Adjunct
Joined: Jun 2007
Posts: 111 |
I ran my tbs needles with two shims and bumped up my main jet 2 sizes after de baffle and de-snorkle and drlled air box but found much too rich black plugs and 180 kms on a tank of petrol. took out the shims dropped the main jet one size. Runs sweet now 230kms per tank before reserve.
keep on adjusting till your happy with it!!
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Re: TBS needles installed, but high idle speed and
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Joined: Jul 2005
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I removed all the (2) shims, 3 turns out, runs better now, more power, but still idles min 1500 rpm. Turning screws fyrther out no effect, turning screws all the way in has minor effect on idle (slightly lower rpm), increases popping greatly tho.
Do I need to go to 45 pilot? Is this the cure?
Am I running a bit too rich, I think so.
Boy, major power improvement in mid rpms, sheesh those TBS needle are good!
cheers,
Don
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Don
04 BA,TBike pipes,AI,FREAK-150 mains,TBS,42 pilot, 3 turns,\progressive fr and rr shocks, 18T,and lotsa chrome
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Re: TBS needles installed, but high idle speed and...
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Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 5,268 Likes: 16
Saddle Sore
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Saddle Sore
Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 5,268 Likes: 16 |
Ok I'm going to ask the obvious (dumb) question. You do realize there is an idle screw adjustment on the left side of the bike,correct? 
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Re: TBS needles installed, but high idle speed and...
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Joined: Jun 2007
Posts: 111
Adjunct
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Adjunct
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There is an idle adjustment on the left side of the bike but if you alter this it drops the carbs out of balance.
I lowered my idle speed but using this adjuster with the other adjuster between the carbs while also having a home made carb balancer fitted I found you have to alter both screws to aidle speed you are happy with and also keep the carbs balanced
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Re: TBS needles installed, but high idle speed and...
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Joined: Nov 2006
Posts: 1,302
Learned Hand
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Learned Hand
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I know I've had troubles after balancing with a home made balancer that once lowering to the correct idle speed with the black knob on the left my carbs showed way out of balance. and it was either cowboy or old roadie who pointed out that the home made balancers are way too sensitive and before getting all worked up it should be rechecked with a mercury balancer to avoid a lot of extra fuss.
mike
2006 neon blue speedmaster
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Re: TBS needles installed, but high idle speed and...
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Joined: Jul 2005
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Yes, I am aware, no matter the setting of the LH side idle speed adjuster, rpm's will not drop below 1500.
Don
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Don
04 BA,TBike pipes,AI,FREAK-150 mains,TBS,42 pilot, 3 turns,\progressive fr and rr shocks, 18T,and lotsa chrome
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Re: TBS needles installed, but high idle speed and...
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Joined: Jun 2007
Posts: 111
Adjunct
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Adjunct
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There is also an adjuster between your carbs that can clearly be seen once the tank is off if this makes no difference you might want to check for freeplay on the throttle ie if there is non it might be holding the slides open a small amount causing the fast idle.
revnd
03 speedie debaffled, de snorkled, drilled slides, Tbs neddles, drill airbox main jets, new bars small speedo
18 tooth
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Re: TBS needles installed, but high idle speed and...
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Joined: Jul 2005
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that appears to have been the problem. I adjusted the throttle cables to give more slack, idles correctly now.
\i am doing the valves now, so pulled plugs and they are kinda dark, so we are running on the rich side. Wonder if the 45 pilots might help(on order).
Cheers, and thanks for the tip.
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Don
04 BA,TBike pipes,AI,FREAK-150 mains,TBS,42 pilot, 3 turns,\progressive fr and rr shocks, 18T,and lotsa chrome
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Re: TBS needles installed, but high idle speed and...
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Joined: May 2007
Posts: 6,432 Likes: 1
Worn Saddle
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Worn Saddle
Joined: May 2007
Posts: 6,432 Likes: 1 |
Quote:
i am doing the valves now, so pulled plugs and they are kinda dark, so we are running on the rich side. Wonder if the 45 pilots might help(on order).
Before you put in a richer pilot you might want to take an extended run to see if the work you were doing on the high idle produced the darker plug tips. 
A positive attitude may not solve all your problems, but it will annoy enough people to make it worth the effort. Herm Albright (1876 - 1944)
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Re: TBS needles installed, but high idle speed and
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Joined: Jul 2006
Posts: 1,337
Learned Hand
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Learned Hand
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2002 Bandit 1200/ GSXR cams/ 1277 BB Kit/ Holeshot header and can/ 38mm flatslides/ a good head/lotsa hp/lotsa tq- lots of rear tires...
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Re: TBS needles installed, but high idle speed and
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Posts: 51
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OK, thanks for tips. I'll ride her around and check plugs again before further changes.
Valve shim job going well, should have her back on er feet today.
Anxious to check out new 440 rear shocks too, did the forks a few weeks ago, awesome. Shoulda been the first mod!
Cheers!!
cheers!
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Don
04 BA,TBike pipes,AI,FREAK-150 mains,TBS,42 pilot, 3 turns,\progressive fr and rr shocks, 18T,and lotsa chrome
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Re: TBS needles installed, but high idle speed and
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Joined: May 2007
Posts: 512
Adjunct
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Quote:
Don,
Did you take a look at our dyno results from NH?
And have you seen Pat's jetting calculator?
I'm no expert, but I don't think the TBS needles need shims.
Certainly not two. I'm running 1 shim w/stock needles.
UNI filter, 45/135, and BUBs. 65.3rwhp, 50ft/lbs torque.
MARKED FOR FUTURE REFERENCE
-Tony
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