Bonneville America Forums Forums Technical Forums General Tech Will not start, electrial !

Got up at 5:30 am get the honey do's outta the way. Butts draggin, head of to pick up my relay at the dealer. 45 mins away in the cage. Back home stick it in, turn the key, lights work hit the start button. Vroom, ah right. Put her back together, gear up. Hit the start button,clickty,clickty.
WTF, check the battery, 12.3v. Crap I guess Skydivejeff is right looks like I need a solenoid.
Noooooooo problem.
Dealers closed until Tuesday and I'm sure they will have to order it they have to order everything. Which will put it here next Saturday if I'm lucky, dang man needs a spare bike sitting around.

Whats that dear? You need what? I'll be right there, back to the honey do list.

Don't forget to check the far end of the battery ground cable. If it's loose there, it will act like a near dead battery sometimes and work just fine other times.

Good idea GB. Where is that cable attached? Have never checked...

mike same problem for me , clickety clickity . so i cleaned and tightened every thing,fuses ,connections etc . charged battery ,put old relay back in and vroom vroom everything appears to be fine(touch wood).i test the battery with a volt meter and get 12.6-12.8 on idle 14+ with choke on, and around 12.5 first thing in morning (after sitting all night).ive been told by a mechanic that if the solenoid goes it does not click at all . i must also say that i cut a small piece out of the positive wire at the battery ,as it had a major kink in it, which i thought may have had a few broken strands of wire in it. so far so good. (now that ive said all that ,you know what comes next .

Gb, I have checked that. Sometimes when I try to start it sounds like the starter kinda half way engages. Like I released the start button to soon or something, sort of a double clutch if you will. Same thing happened when I put the new relay in.
I'm beginning to wonder if the starter is going out, I hope not.
Any way to check that?
Mike

Mike,

The next time your unit goes clickety click, immediately take the side cover off to gain access to the solenoid and short the two solenoid leads with a heavy jumper wire. This will bypass the solenoid and the relay that powers the solenoid (I'm assuming your relay is good though). This will bypass the solenoid contacts ensuring the starter gets full battery voltage. If the unit starts, you have a bad solenoid.

Make sure the bike is in neutral!!!

Oh yes, one more thing, have you checked to see if your starter bolts are tight? A loose starter will give you the same condition.

Or you can do what I have done...I semi-perminatly wired a starter button (from NAPA) to "jump" the two leads on the solinoid...did it at the GA rally took all of tem Min...I still have it on the bike today and still use it...works great...and that solinoid is like a $50.00 part...just be careful it will start (or try to) in gear...ask me how I know

Hi Gregger, I have double checked all connections. Brand new relay.
I'll give the jumper a try. If it is the solenoid can I leave the jumper in place for a while until I can make other arrangements?
Mike

One other thing you didn't mention (Maybe I didn't see it scanning the thread) was when the start problem takes place? Was it with the unit in neutral, or in gear with the clutch engaged, or both?
If in neutral, the starter relay finds it's ground through the neutral switch. If in gear, it finds ground through the clutch switch then the sidestand switch. If both, then chances are it isn't the ground for the starter relay.

Do you have a starter circuit print?

Gregger
Both in gear and in neutral, yes I have a manual with the print out.
Good suggestions.

I understand about the jumper, I spoke before I thought.
I understand the starter will continue to engage with the jumper, even in gear.
I'll give the jumper a go and see what happens.
Thanks,
Mike

Gregger, I tried to start the bike. Same problem.
I then tried the jumper and bingo the starter engaged.
Try again without the jumper clickity,click.
Back to the jumper and bingo the starter engages.
Looks like you have diagnosed my problem.
Thank you very much, learned something new today. Well actually my memory was refreshed today. We used to do the same thing back in the day with a screw driver on an old Chevy. Funny I had forgotten about that.
looks like I'll be shopping for a solenoid.
Thanks again,
Mike

Glad to help. Keep us posted.

It's too bad you can't open the solenoid up. You probably have some burnt contacts that can be cleaned up with a fine point file.

I had a similar problem once. I took it to an auto electrician, he came wiggled the leads, tightened them and bang off she went. Charged me a $1 to do it. First thing I check these days.

Well I have replaced the battery,starter relay and the starter solenoid. And you guessed it, still clickety click.
When I made the jumper for the solenoid it was kinda crappy and the bike turned over slow. I made a better one and it turns over real slow, starter maybe?
I have checked all connections, 12.4 volts, I'm stumped.

Mike, I'm thinking you have a bad ground somewhere now.

Phil, maybe. I'm going to dive into this thing a little deeper tomorrow.
I have checked and rechecked all the connections but I'm going to go over it again.
Keep in mind the bike started 5 times before it finally went co-puts. Acts just like a dead battery, this battery is very strong. It has done this on and off on occasion.
The battery is pushing out 12.4 volts, I dunno know it's a weird one.

These intermittent electrical problems will drive you friggin crazy!

The only thing I can suggest is to unbolt all starting circuit connections, scape/sand everything clean, apply some dielectric grease, and re-assemble. If you do all that and with what you have replaced and still having problems, I'd start suspecting the starter and the solenoid on it. That you should be able to take to a good shop and have it tested.

You need to perform some voltage drop tests.

1. Place voltmeter across battery & record voltage when cranking starter. Get it when cranking and clicking if possible, especially if the starter is turning slowly. Shouldn't drop below 9.6 volts. If lower make sure the battery is charged up and try again. If still low the starter might be at fault or you could have a bad/corroded connection acting like a big resistor which you will have to find. If the voltage is really high when the no start condition takes place (clickity click) check for loose connections. You could have some worn out brushes on the starter which could give you this or loose ground from the brushes inside the starter. I think the starter is supposed to be sealed. If you remove it, oil could drain from the engine. Might be contaminated with oil??? Not sure. Looking at a breakdown of the starter, the brushes are servicable.

2. Place + lead on solenoid terminal (large one) closest to battery and - lead on large terminal closest to starter. Crank and record voltage (should be really low around .1 volts) This will check the resistance of the terminals on and in the solenoid. Probably do not need to do this since you changed the solenoid but this will eliminate guessing.

3. Place + voltmeter lead to - battery terminal and - voltmeter lead somewhere on bare metal of frame. Crank engine. Voltage should be less than .5 volts. If higher, you have a bad ground connection from the battery to frame.

There are many more checks you can make but this should help narrow things out a bit.

If it is the starter, don't buy a new one. As bonnyusa stated have it tested. It should be repairable for a lot less than new. If you need brushes and can't get them easily, an electronic shop should be able to set you up with generic ones.

well after letting the bike sit since wednesday night, i fired it up last night no problems . went to start this morning and guess what, turned over but no start then clickety clickity . ive been checking the battery every day with the volt meter and its stayed around 12.5ish ,checked last night after 4 nights and it was 12.4 and started no problem
checked with meter when i got home today and 12.33. jumped the solenoid and it cranked over but very slowly .will be trying Greggers suggestions tomorrow .i wonder if anyone named Lucas works for triumph in the electrical dept

Celt, You just described my symptoms to a tee.
Currently my bike is starting.
Last night I took both ground connections loose.
Nothing was even remotely corroded but I did it anyway
Used my dremel tool and a wire wheel. Polished everything even remotely connected to the ground,battery terminals,all leads,engine block,etc.. Di electric grease on all connections. Now I just ride and see what happens.
Mike
If it happens again I'm pulling the starter.

This just started happening to me as well. Don't know if it's intermittant or not as it won't start now and it just happened today.

Did you end up having to pull your starter? I'm still under warranty but I want to know what I'm talking about when I call the dealer.

Andrew

"I want to do know" omg that was funny.

Forget about it man, it'll never happen. lol

Okay, my ribs hurt but I'll try again...

Start with the stuff you need to do anyhow.

Clean battery connections up. Clean solenoid contacts behind right airbox cover. Clean ground strap connection. Clean starter power cable connection.

No go?


Pull tank. Check starter relay.

Call dealer now. (Use past tense; I cleaned the bat'tree connections,...

Guys, I have removed and wire brushed everything associated with the starter. Replaced the relay,starter solenoid. Checked all connections, all fuses and re greased. Not a bit of corrosion anywhere.
I even cleaned the block and bolts with a wire brush
I cleaned the start button with contact cleaner. The only thing left is the starter. I have suspected the starter from the beginning. Everyone seems to think it's not the starter.
Well I will find out next week.I purchased a used starter from a member. I'm going to pull my starter and take both to have tested.
We'll see. If that's not it I might have a beautiful 03 America for sale. This shat is getting old.
Mike

Robs, solutation is a good one. This of course this never worked for me. When I tried this on several ocassions the starter turned over very slowly and would not fire.
I have replace the relay, solenoid,battery. The olny things left are the start button and the starter.
Mike

I used Robs method on my tow truck when I had a bad solinoid. It works. Never tried it a bike but I know many HD riders who are friends of mine who have. There is even an after market starter end with the button already in it for those guys.

Ok, I thought I would put and end to this novel.
Apperantly the regulator was the culprit. This thing toasted two batteries. I replaced the regulator, installed the third battery and presto magnifico she runs.
During my trails and tribulations I replaced the starter relay,solnoid,starter,regulator,ignition switch,coils,three batteries. Checked and dielectric greased every switch,bulb,spade clip,fuse,ground several times.
Special thanks to Chy for the moral support and technical advice. Special thanks to Bikerthug. Several transplanted organs from BT's Speedy are know roaming the hills of Tennessee.
Mike

Good deal Mike.

On the bright side, you now have lots of spare parts!