 Are bicycles that much safer? (no)
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I have a few friends who's old ladies would crap a brick over them having a motorcycle but don't mind them riding bicycles(and these guys have been riding for years).Now there may be different risks involved but bicycle riding to me can be just as hazardous.This is also my wifes view(now) as well.She does medical transcription and runs across a few motorcycle accidents but runs into just as many bicycle ones too.Try to tell these same women would be just an exercise of futility because of their prejudices on motorcycles.Now I know there is always your exceptions but women seem to have this initial chafing more then men on motorcycle safty.That was even the case with my wife and it took three years of "working" on her and she stoped fighting me about it,so now I'm riding(motorcycles) 
She's a Lady and the Lady is 100% mine !
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Re: Are bicycles that much safer? (no)
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It's probably due to magnitude of accident. Injury is caused by unplanned deceleration - sudden, smack into a truck, or gradual, sliding down tarmac. How much deceleration you need to do to stop is directly related to the speed you're doing. Unless you're Lance Armstrong you're probably only doing 10-15mph on a bicycle. I don't know anyone who rides a bike that slow! Also, few cyclists wipe themselves out, but a large proportion of bike accidents are rider error, no-one else involved.
I wouldn't argue with women.. they're pretty smart generally!!
The westernmost Triumph in Europe
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Re: Are bicycles that much safer? (no)
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You should try reading the cycling newsgroups...lots of cyclist getting hit/killed all the time.
Just a year or two ago, an old man hit many cyclist, one after the other, as he was driving down the road. The cyclist were all single file on the side, obeying the law.
And trust me on this one, sliding down a wet road at 15-20 mph hour on ones leg with just lycra shorts on (and a 17 lb bicycle between the legs) can be pretty nasty. I got pretty -messed up on that occasion.
As for myself, I've been hit head on by a 90 y.o. geezer wearing an oxygen mask while driving a tank. He ran a red light. I watched his eyes bug out as he drove straight towards me. I was bale to dive forward onto his hood, while pushing my bicycle backwards. I survived, my bike survived, and the old man survuved my verbal assualt.
Brad
Neon Blue '05 SM
Where are the pedals on this thing?
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Re: Are bicycles that much safer? (no)
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I ride bicycles and motorbikes. I suspect that there are less serious injuries (per hour ridden) on bicycles. My reasoning: As said above, your average speed on a bicycle is perhaps 15mph, with a maximum of, say, 35mph (unless you're very fit or live in a very hilly area  ). A bicycle with decent brakes (hydraulic disc brakes are fairly comon on mountainbikes nowadays) will stop in a shorter distance than a motorbike. A bicycle is more manoeuvreable at low speeds - it's easier to take evasive action. On the other hand: Cyclists generally wear a lot less protective gear. I did a 20 mile bicycle ride this morning wearing shorts, t-shirt and a lightweight helmet. If I'd done the same ride on my motorbike I'd have had a leather jacket, kevlar lined jeans and a full face helmet. Go figure. The bottom line - I enjoy riding them both. Both activities have an element of risk, but the risk is small enough for me to consider it acceptable. I will continue to ride both as long as I am able to.
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Re: Are bicycles that much safer? (no)
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Loquacious
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Quote:
I wouldn't argue with women.. they're pretty smart generally!!
What else can I say..... 
I get really narked at bicycles. They regularly run red lights, don't give a $hit about other road users and generally annoy me (I don't mean you in this Simon...) Around October time last year, one pulled onto the road in front of me, didn't even look and caused me to swerve into the path of a car. OK i was in the bus lane - which before anyone rants at me for that, we're allowed to in Bristol - and the car was going in the same direction, so if the thing had hit me, it wouldn't have been as bad as a head-on. But it would have caused damage to me and my bike.
Then bugger me, the same bloke does the same thing to me the next day at the same place...GRRRRRRRRRRRRR
I now treat them with complete and total distain....
Gina
03 America - Pretty stock - except the TBS wheel... 
06 America - missing, presumed in bits. With it's TBS wheel... 
09 America - It's very blue....
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Re: Are bicycles that much safer? (no)
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It's the slow speeds on a bicycle that worry me.For example you are on a twisty road going 15mph.Now a car going 50-60mph around those same bends with no time to stop scares the hell out of me!
She's a Lady and the Lady is 100% mine !
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Re: Are bicycles that much safer? (no)
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In reply to Gina's comment.It burns me to no end to run into a bunch of cyclist that think they own the road!When I am on my motorcycle I realize I'm pretty low on the road food chain.Now bicycles are lower and are at the very bottom of that chain!
She's a Lady and the Lady is 100% mine !
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Re: Are bicycles that much safer? (no)
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Should be Riding
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I ride my road bike pretty quick. Probably mid 20's average. Mountain biking is a whole other arena, different obstacles etc. which I also do occasionally. I do agree that women's "mom" instinct is different between motorized or pedal bikes. I've been riding my bike alone around town since I was 10, but when I got my America my mom flipped. Go figure! Maybe it's partially that pedal bikes have been in everyone's life since they were kids so it's easier to swallow? I've even had a few pretty darn goo wipe outs as a kid on my bike and it's still "better" says mom. Plus, it's harder to see a cyclist! Smaller target as it were.
But I agree with the statement about less SERIOUS injuries. I think that's the same reason that a woman in her early 20's will pay less car insurance. I think women get into more accidents, but they are usually fender benders as opposed to the typical male racing kind of accidents where people get hurt, etc.
Benny
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Re: Are bicycles that much safer? (no)
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Quote:
They regularly run red lights, don't give a $hit about other road users
Don't tar us all with the same brush. I saw a motorcyclist pulling a wheelie through town yesterday - does that mean that all motorcyclists ride dangerously? I'm not going to condone all the actions of all cyclists, that would be plain stupid, but I'm sure that if you look at the majority of cyclists you'll find them riding safely. Any cyclist who doesn't give a $hit about other road users won't be a cyclist for long, because he'll be dead pretty damn soon.
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It burns me to no end to run into a bunch of cyclist that think they own the road!When I am on my motorcycle I realize I'm pretty low on the road food chain.Now bicycles are lower and are at the very bottom of that chain!
I don't know what the law in the US is, but in the UK cyclists have as much right to use the road as cars, motorbikes etc.
It really frustrates me when motorcyclists have a go at cyclists. We have so much in common (small and vulnerable, despised by a proportion of car drivers, the ability to get through traffic quickly, how we are affected by the weather etc etc) we should be standing together, not arguing with each other.
Last point - try riding a bicycle through your local town, then come back and tell me what it's like being at the bottom of the food chain.
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Re: Are bicycles that much safer? (no)
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The only bicycle I ride is in my basement, has one wheel and the handlebars move with the pedals. It's the only bike I have not fallen off, but I still hurt my knee on it. I won't ride a bicycle on the street: to slow and no respect from anyone(cars or motorcycles). I had some dumba** in a Saab tailgaiting me on the way to work this AM. Speed up or slow down and he stuck there: 2 downshifts on the TBS and I blasted away. I could not do that with pedals, so I think the motorized version is safer (for me anyway) . Mike Sr.
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Re: Are bicycles that much safer? (no)
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Monkey Butt
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Monkey Butt
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Quote:
I wouldn't argue with women.. they're pretty smart generally!!
"He says with his wife watching over his shoulder."
We all like to think of ourselves as rugged individualists. But when push comes to shove most of us are sheep who do what we are told. Worst of all, a lot of us become unpaid agents of whoever is controlling the agenda by enforcing the current dogma on the few rugged individualists who actually exist.
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Re: Are bicycles that much safer? (no)
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Should be Riding
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Quote:
I don't know what the law in the US is, but in the UK cyclists have as much right to use the road as cars, motorbikes etc.
You are correct. In fact I think they have the right of way, aso do pedestrians. A rule MOST people forget around here anyway. The logic is simple. They (cyclist/pedestrians) are way smaller and could get killed if you hit em. Now the right of way doesn't mean they should disregard the rules and take advantage, they have just as much responsability as the cages to follow the rules of the road. I admit to bending them on my bike (pedal), but never when cars are around...
Benny
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Re: Are bicycles that much safer? (no)
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Loquacious
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I wasn't saying that there aren't irresponsible motorcyclists or that there aren't responsible cyclists either. It's just the irresponsible cyclists that I notice....along with the irresponsible bikers...
Gina
03 America - Pretty stock - except the TBS wheel...
06 America - missing, presumed in bits. With it's TBS wheel...
09 America - It's very blue....
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Re: Are bicycles that much safer? (no)
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Should be Riding
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I saw a guy on a rice-rocket doing a one footed wheelie down the left lane (along the Jersey barrier) on the cross bronx expressway the other day. For those of you not familiar, that's I95 thru New York City. Potentially the busiest 6 lanes in NY. Also some of the WORST road surface!! The drainage grates are about 4 inches below the pavement, and there are HUGE lumps in the pavement from all the trucks. And the dude was doing a wheelie.... There are jackasses everywhere! And unfortunately that shine above the rest...
Benny
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Re: Are bicycles that much safer? (no)
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Should be Riding
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As far as safety, look in a mirror. That is the epicenter of it all. You can see yourself, others cannot. Be it on a bicycle or a motorsickle. However, peddling a bike is way different that twisting a throttle. No noise (except for the sound of your tires spinning underneath), flight at will (every little bump is a launch point) and endorphins rushing through your body. Peddling a bicycle close to traffic is the preferred method for solo speed. The closer the cages pass the better the draft. Want a thrill? Learn how to peddle. Only when you can ride for miles without a thought, will you experience bicycling nirvana. When you can separate the mind from the body you will know what it means to ride. Heck. Two wheels are dangerous dude. Give me yours so ya won’t hurt yourself!
Blowing gravel off rural roads
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Re: Are bicycles that much safer? (no)
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Actualy on a bicycle you have to observe the traffic laws like any other vehicle on the road.Told by a cop that you can get a ticket for running a light or stop sign.
She's a Lady and the Lady is 100% mine !
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Re: Are bicycles that much safer? (no)
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Should be Riding
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Yup I know. I am pretty good about it, and I usually ride back roads so there isn't much by way of stops. I also grew up in a small town where I had all kinds of short cuts thru yards, etc so as to avoid the road
Benny
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Re: Are bicycles that much safer? (no)
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Loquacious
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i think guy's for the most part are thrill seekers and women are mom's. by that i mean, alot of women i have known wouldnt ride a rollercoaster where as almost all the guy's i have known would be first in line. women (not all but most) tend to play it safe in almost every case, men (again, not all) tend to forge ahead. it was Daniel Boone that went searching, it was Columbus that decided to sail off to see what was there, notice it wasnt Mrs. Boone or Mrs. Columbus. women have that nurturing thing that is always looking at the saftey issues in any situation. men tend to put their blinders on and GO, to hell with the consiquences. also women know that it will be them that picks up the mess and deals with the long term affects if (God forbid) something bad happens. they tend to fear the unknown. NOW you take a woman and put her on a Bike after formal training so they understand, and their whole thought process tends to change and become more accepting. notice, more and more women are rideing these days. by being taught to understand it and how to correctly operate this machine they tend to ease up on the fear factor. bicycles, they understand, becuase they probably had one or a dozen in their life, so they think of that as being ok...ie; hey i rode my bike over to all my friends houses when i was a kid, nothing ever happened to me and it wasnt that hard or complicated so it must be ok. but a Motorcycle, why that has an engine and go's fast and you read everyday in the paper about someone getting hurt, so it must be unsafe and bad. Where in reality. LIFE is unsafe... period!!!!!! ITS A MOM'S INSTINCT THING AND FEAR OF THE UNKNOWN. well thats the way i see it hahahahahahaha its as good as any other reason and to me the only one that makes sense. 
ENJOY!!!!! NEWT!!!!!
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Re: Are bicycles that much safer? (no)
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Bar Shake
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Bar Shake
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Quote:
Quote:
I don't know what the law in the US is, but in the UK cyclists have as much right to use the road as cars, motorbikes etc.
You are correct. In fact I think they have the right of way, aso do pedestrians. A rule MOST people forget around here anyway. The logic is simple. They (cyclist/pedestrians) are way smaller and could get killed if you hit em. Now the right of way doesn't mean they should disregard the rules and take advantage, they have just as much responsability as the cages to follow the rules of the road. I admit to bending them on my bike (pedal), but never when cars are around...
I dunno about NY, but in NV the same road laws that apply to motorized vehicles apply to human powered vehicles.
The main problem I see is that when people start riding bicycles they are usually just kids and don't fully understand the rules of the road. So, they begin to believe that stop signs and traffic signals don't apply to them. Add to this parents that give bad advice, such as "ride against the traffic, so you can see who's coming towards you" or "ride on the sidewalk". That might be okay for little kids with training wheels, but once the skill level increases, they attain higher speeds and cause all kinds of problems. Bad habits learned as children can last a long time, and are difficult to unlearn.
Most adult bicyclists understand that their bike is not a toy, but a vehicle and respect all that implies. But there's always a few idiots that make things difficult for everyone.
Contra todo mal, mezcal; contra todo bien, también
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Re: Are bicycles that much safer? (no)
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Learned Hand
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This goes with "say it is not true" and "what was he thinking"
I'm in KC this week on business and I went out to lunch with a bunch of suits, my alter ego during the day.
We were on I-25 four lane we were going about 65 and had maybe a dozen other cars around us.
In the right hand lane comes this "moron" on a crotch rocket sneakers, shorts no shirt and no helmet. He swings into the break down lane and passes everyone had to be going 85 once he gets by everyone he swings out into the middle lane stands up on the pegs and pulls the nose off the ground, I'm not talking a couple of feet he stood the bike right up on its tail the front wheel had to be a good eight feet off the ground. He did this about eight times before he bolted away at well over 100 mph.
This kid my have know how to ride his bike, but the damage these mornons do to the rest of us is unmeasureable.
The first words out of the guy's I was with was "look at this nut" "typical motorcyclist" "whacked out junkie".
Not only is this kid going to kill himself, but he ruins the life of the guy who runs him over plus he could have caused a hugh pileup if he lost control and I assure you the headlines would read.
Crazed Motorcyclist causes massive pileup on I-25.
What I saw today was truely unbelieveable and outright reckless.
John 06 America Mulberry\Silver
"Seemed Like A Good Idea At The Time"
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Re: Are bicycles that much safer? (no)
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Should be Riding
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Should be Riding
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Sounds like the guy I saw on the Cross Bronx except add a T shirt and a helmet.
Benny
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Re: Are bicycles that much safer? (no)
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Should be Riding
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Should be Riding
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Bill, yeah in NY same laws go for everyone. But then again, most CARS don't go by the rules, and 90% of the cyclist on the road are the immigrant workers, so I think it's a simple fact of people just don't KNOW the rules. Scary.
Benny
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Re: Are bicycles that much safer? (no)
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Old Hand
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A bicycle can't accelerate out of the way as readily.
Due to the generally lower speed, exposure to redlight/stop sign runners is a lot higher.
There there is the typical rider who thinks he is immune to stopsigns, lane and even direction restrictions. I imagine that the idiots who rid in a group 4 or 5 across instead of singlefile blocking traffic lanes whilst riding 10 - 15 MPH freustrate some people to the point that if they don't get themselves run over, they will cause someone farther down the road to be smashed.
Then, of course, there are the fools who pedal very slowly and wander all over the place because they are too busy yapping on the phone to pay attention.
Let's hope there's intelligent life somewhere in space 'cause it's buggar all down here. -- Monte Python
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 Re: Are bicycles that much safer? (no)
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Monkey Butt
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Monkey Butt
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We're always hearing how we should "Share the road" with pedal pushers. At least weekly there is a letter to the editor with a bicyclist complaining about the lack of respect they get from motorists. I always wonder if these are the same inconsiderate boobs who hog the road at 10 mph. ignore traffic signals, flout the rules of the road and can't decide if they are pedestrians or not. Funny how they never get a ticket for things that would net a motorist or motorcyclist a traffic ticket and a huge fine. 
We all like to think of ourselves as rugged individualists. But when push comes to shove most of us are sheep who do what we are told. Worst of all, a lot of us become unpaid agents of whoever is controlling the agenda by enforcing the current dogma on the few rugged individualists who actually exist.
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Re: Are bicycles that much safer? (no)
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Quote:
We're always hearing how we should "Share the road" with pedal pushers...
A safety guideline for biking is to get about 3 foot from the road side so to "force" the car to pass normally rather then enticing the car to squeeze by (and clip w/mirror or something). 
The same cagers who have problems with bikes also have problems with sharing the road with motorcycles. But, I agree, just today I complained to my wife about a couple of bikers on the road not following the rules of safety or common sence.
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- 2007 Triumph Tiger
- 1982 Yamaha xj650 Magnum
- Previous 2004 Triumph America
- Previous 1973 Triumph Bonneville T140V 750cc
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Re: Are bicycles that much safer? (no)
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I do a few triathlons a year that require a fair amount of road bike riding. I can easily support that I have had more accidents and close calls by far on my bicycle then the TBA. Even though i am an experienced biker, I am scared to death of riding the local streets so spend most of my time on a nearby bike trail (50 miles worth!!). But even there, of course, are runners, walkers, children biking, families, etc. that you have to be aware of and share the trail. Average 20+ mph on super skinny tire is kinda scary. In fact, once when my head was slammed onto the pavement as a result of (my stupidity of course) my glove getting caught in the front spoke convinced me that if my helmet protected my head on a bicycle then it was even more important on a motorcycle. My helmet was split in half, and I only went black for a moment.
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- 2007 Triumph Tiger
- 1982 Yamaha xj650 Magnum
- Previous 2004 Triumph America
- Previous 1973 Triumph Bonneville T140V 750cc
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Re: Are bicycles that much safer? (no)
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Should be Riding
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You are lucky to have that path! There are a few old railroads in new england that are now paths. Long, flat, straight, BORING but they are there! Mert and I rode by a bunch of mountain bikers today. Lots of that out here, but not good road biking.
Benny
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Re: Are bicycles that much safer? (no)
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Last point - try riding a bicycle through your local town, then come back and tell me what it's like being at the bottom of the food chain.
Amen. I am also an avid roadie, and it is scary out there without a motor. I think the vast majority of bikers obey the laws and do not hog the road (too scared).
I am writing this from vacation in the mountains of North Carolina. There are thousands of motorcycles and bicycles on the roads here, especially on the Blue Ridge Parkway. The guys without motors get tons less respect than us on motorcycles.
I used to bring my bicycle here to ride while on vacation, but after cagers trying to lean out the window and PUSH me off the road (not a rare occurence for cyclists) twice, I no longer bring it. I now stick to the America. Probably as many motorcycles as cars on the road this weekend.
Yep, try riding at the very bottom of the food chain like Simon mentioned. Scary.
'05 America
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