 My One Rant on the Modern Classics
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Joined: Jul 2010
Posts: 348
Adjunct
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OP
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Joined: Jul 2010
Posts: 348 |
I would like to start off by saying that I love my '06 Creamsicle. It is a great bike and has been real reliable. It is because of my experience with this motor that I have decided to stay in the Bonnie family when I get my cruiser. Being able to share certain parts, gaskets, seals, etc has a value to me as well as having a very nice cruiser at a very good price. With that said, the one aspect of this motor that really annoys the heck out of me is the design on the cam cover. I can't call it a leak but more of a seapage problem but either way, these cam covers on the Bonnies are not oil tight. This is something A LOT of Bonnie owners share together and has been a problem since the Hinckley plant brought the Bonnies back. I have come to find out that the seal is of high quality and stays good a long time but it is the cam cover bolts that wear out waaaaaaay too fast. I replace the cam cover bolts with the ridiculously low nm ratings set for them and I am good for about 3,000 miles before it starts seeping again. Are you America/Speedmaster owners experiencing the same problems with the cam covers as well?
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Re: My One Rant on the Modern Classics
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Joined: Apr 2007
Posts: 3,063 Likes: 8
Loquacious
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Loquacious
Joined: Apr 2007
Posts: 3,063 Likes: 8 |
No leaks whatsoever. I have had my cam cover off several times, never replacing the silicone gasket or the seals on the retainer bolts. 25,000 kms on the bike so far.
12 Rocket Roadster
03 Bonneville America
69 BSA Firebird Scrambler
73 Yamaha TX 750
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Re: My One Rant on the Modern Classics
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Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 7,689 Likes: 21
Monkey Butt
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Monkey Butt
Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 7,689 Likes: 21 |
25,000 miles no leaks here on a 790.
I try to aggravate one person a day. Today may be your day.
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Re: My One Rant on the Modern Classics
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Joined: Jul 2010
Posts: 348
Adjunct
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OP
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Posts: 348 |
Wow...these are the same cam covers right? My '06 is a 790 as well and it seaps. I know the problem and I know when it is going to start seaping again. I change out the cam cover bolts and it fixes it for a certain amount of time. This is a real common thing with the Bonnies throughout all ten years of the Hinckley Bonnie. That is icing on the cake if the BA/SM do not have this problem...best of both worlds.
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Re: My One Rant on the Modern Classics
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Joined: Feb 2007
Posts: 23,198 Likes: 56
Fe Butt
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Fe Butt
Joined: Feb 2007
Posts: 23,198 Likes: 56 |
my 790 hasn't leaked a drop and I reused the gasket after my valve adjustment, have about 23,000 on it.
I learned all I need to know about life by killing smart people and eating their brains.
Eat right ,Exercise ,Stay fit, Die Anyway!
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Re: My One Rant on the Modern Classics
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Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 12,164 Likes: 1
Should be Riding
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Should be Riding
Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 12,164 Likes: 1 |
Almost 30,000 on my '04 and not a single leak. Should be the exact same cam covers. Actually the only diffence in motors is the crank (270 degree vs 360).
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Re: My One Rant on the Modern Classics
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Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 10,722 Likes: 5
Should be Riding
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Should be Riding
Joined: Aug 2007
Posts: 10,722 Likes: 5 |
Always remember to be yourself. Unless you suck. Then pretend to be someone else.
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Re: My One Rant on the Modern Classics
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Joined: Oct 2008
Posts: 2,420
Oil Expert
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Oil Expert
Joined: Oct 2008
Posts: 2,420 |
25K on my 03 speedy and no leaks whatsoever.
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Re: My One Rant on the Modern Classics
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Joined: Mar 2007
Posts: 5,616
Check Pants
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Check Pants
Joined: Mar 2007
Posts: 5,616 |
22k and the only leak is me.
SOLD: 07 Black BA, 39mm FCRs, TPUSA stage 1 head, TPUSA 813 cams, TPUSA 10.8:1 pistons, TTP #3 igniter, Specialty Spares Long Cannons, Tsukayu Hard Bags. 82HP/55tq
NEW: 19 Goldwing Tour DCT
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Re: My One Rant on the Modern Classics
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Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 6,821
Bar Shake
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Bar Shake
Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 6,821 |
40,000 on mine. Had the cover off about four times and reused everything. No leaks.
Contra todo mal, mezcal; contra todo bien, también
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Re: My One Rant on the Modern Classics
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Joined: Mar 2009
Posts: 12,964
Stickman Yogi
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Stickman Yogi
Joined: Mar 2009
Posts: 12,964 |
22,000 km... no leaks, no seepage. Still doesn't explain your problem though. 
Live to love, love to live.
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Re: My One Rant on the Modern Classics
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Joined: Jul 2010
Posts: 348
Adjunct
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OP
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Joined: Jul 2010
Posts: 348 |
This really is puzzling; I consider myself knowing this engine as pretty fair...I am able to do most of all the work myself. With that said, I have no idea there would be the difference other than the 270/360 difference between the models. I do know that the cam covers seeping is a very consistent problem amongst the Bonnie owners and this has stayed the same throughout the Hinckley years. That is usually the one big complaint about the Bonnies...that these covers still seep. It is great that this does not affect the BA/SM but it surely makes me wonder why...
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Re: My One Rant on the Modern Classics
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Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 4,072 Likes: 80
Loquacious
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Loquacious
Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 4,072 Likes: 80 |
I worked at a dealer for awhile and have seen the leaks that you speak of on both models.. mostly Bonnies but always fixed with a new gasket.
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Re: My One Rant on the Modern Classics
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Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 1,836 Likes: 5
Learned Hand
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Learned Hand
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 1,836 Likes: 5 |
I have no doubt that this is common knowledge but just the same, those having repetitive problems may be unaware ; Torquing sequence (Pattern) and steps (Incremental) are equally important as the end setting itself.
2004 Triumph Speedmaster (J Lo) 2006 Yamaha Stratoliner (Adele)
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Re: My One Rant on the Modern Classics
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Joined: Feb 2007
Posts: 23,198 Likes: 56
Fe Butt
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Fe Butt
Joined: Feb 2007
Posts: 23,198 Likes: 56 |
I just snugged mine up and Wendys when I did her chrome cover in no particular order with a regular wrench. My torque setting was when I felt it was tight enough. (not advocating not torquing sh!t)
I learned all I need to know about life by killing smart people and eating their brains.
Eat right ,Exercise ,Stay fit, Die Anyway!
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Re: My One Rant on the Modern Classics
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Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 131
Adjunct
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Adjunct
Joined: Sep 2006
Posts: 131 |
My 06 TBA has been slow leaking from the cam covers since about 10,000. It's 16,500 now. I have a new gasket waiting for me in the garage but it sounds like I should get me some new cam cover bolts.
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Re: My One Rant on the Modern Classics
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Joined: May 2006
Posts: 525
Adjunct
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Adjunct
Joined: May 2006
Posts: 525 |
My 05 tba also developed a very minor bit of seapage at about 10K miles. I got a new gasket when I had my valves adjusted a couple months ago, and it has been perfectly dry since then.
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Re: My One Rant on the Modern Classics
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Joined: Mar 2009
Posts: 12,964
Stickman Yogi
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Stickman Yogi
Joined: Mar 2009
Posts: 12,964 |
Quote:
It is great that this does not affect the BA/SM but it surely makes me wonder why...
Yeah Matt... and I can't help but wonder what difference new bolts would make! I'm sure you've tried this but maybe just going over them bolts in the right sequence with proper torque would do it. Or even back them off, then tighten again to specs.
Maybe it's the reseating that does it and not the new bolts...
Live to love, love to live.
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Re: My One Rant on the Modern Classics
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Joined: Mar 2008
Posts: 1,586 Likes: 1
Learned Hand
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Learned Hand
Joined: Mar 2008
Posts: 1,586 Likes: 1 |
Maybe they built that leak in there so to make them more like the old ones. 
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Re: My One Rant on the Modern Classics
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Joined: Jul 2010
Posts: 348
Adjunct
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OP
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Joined: Jul 2010
Posts: 348 |
Quote:
Quote:
It is great that this does not affect the BA/SM but it surely makes me wonder why...
Yeah Matt... and I can't help but wonder what difference new bolts would make! I'm sure you've tried this but maybe just going over them bolts in the right sequence with proper torque would do it. Or even back them off, then tighten again to specs.
Maybe it's the reseating that does it and not the new bolts...
The four cam cover bolts have a fairly thick rubber washer or grommets to them with one side being metallic...shiny side goes up. It has been my experience that it is the rubber seals on these bolts that get squished over time and from that, the very slight seeping that takes place. I think it would become a full-on leak if it was the cam cover seal itself that kept going. This seal, in my opinion, is a great seal and made really well. Very thick and consistent rubber. I have always tightened down the cam cover bolts by hand then torque them down to 10 nm in an X pattern starting at the top right one. I do know that Triumph has changed their torque setting for the cam cover to 14 nm and I assume they re-considered this because of the seeping problem that has been reported back to the headquarters. I have also read where some people will use with the rubber grommet on the cam cover bolts with a very...VERY thin washer so that each bolt has the chance to seat on the threads as they should and acts as a cushion so that the grommets won't get crushed. This is the next step that I am going to give a try and will report back how it goes. It is more of a nusance than anything else but I am on the anal side of how my engine is. I would love to get a chrome cam cover for my Creamsicle but I am not going to spend the money until I know I can eliminate this seeping. I think the recent change to 14 nm on the setting might have the effect that is needed; I wish Triumph would of been more aggressive in advertising this though.
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Re: My One Rant on the Modern Classics
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Joined: Jul 2010
Posts: 348
Adjunct
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OP
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Quote:
Maybe they built that leak in there so to make them more like the old ones.
Actually, the correction terminology with British engineering is: "the external lubrication system."
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Re: My One Rant on the Modern Classics
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Joined: Jul 2010
Posts: 348
Adjunct
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OP
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Quote:
My 06 TBA has been slow leaking from the cam covers since about 10,000. It's 16,500 now. I have a new gasket waiting for me in the garage but it sounds like I should get me some new cam cover bolts.
Hey CT...I would get in the habit of changing your cam cover bolts whenever you decide to change the seal. These bolts are often overlooked but I think they are the culprit. When you get the cover off then you will see what I mean...the rubber grommets on these bolts are easy to get squished. Definitely order four new ones...you might as well change them while you have your cover off and doing your seal.
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Re: My One Rant on the Modern Classics
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Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 18,825
"Lighten up, Francis."
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"Lighten up, Francis."
Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 18,825 |
Hahaha... I was just telling some old dude again this morning, they're just like the old bikes 'cept no oil leaks... that and trying to convince him that Triumph never really went away without telling him he was just ignorant/uninformed through the late 80s and 90's...
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Re: My One Rant on the Modern Classics
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Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 6,821
Bar Shake
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Bar Shake
Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 6,821 |
Quote:
I just snugged mine up and Wendys when I did her chrome cover in no particular order with a regular wrench. My torque setting was when I felt it was tight enough. (not advocating not torquing sh!t)
Well yeah Ian. You and I both know that the hands of experience become quite accurate for most applications, especially those requiring low torque values like the cam covers.
When I was flat-rating, my impact was my torque wrench. 
Contra todo mal, mezcal; contra todo bien, también
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Re: My One Rant on the Modern Classics
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Joined: Jun 2009
Posts: 507
Adjunct
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Adjunct
Joined: Jun 2009
Posts: 507 |
My speedy has the same issue. Started at about 16000 miles.
2005 Speedmaster, Tornado Red, AI removed, Uni Pods, JCW 19" turnouts
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