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Electrical Mods Questions
#288248 08/21/2008 8:06 AM
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I have not heard much chatter about modifying the electrical systems, except for filing the plugs. The basic premise for minor engine modifications appears to have been focused on to modify fuel and air components, but not so much on spark. Brent and some of the other aftermarket sources offer high end spark plug, plug wires, and coils, but I have not been able to research on this site or RAT.net how much benefit these aftermarket items provide for our Triumphs.

If my memory serves me correctly (and this is always not the case) There always were multiple discussion about older Harleys (shovelhead's and EVO's) upgrading there ignition spark systems. I am in no way comparing the bikes or their associated electrial systems, but rather comparing the potential for results with and older engine design. Maybe it is because thier electrical systems were poorly designed or our bike have better stock systems?

Any input or insight would be appreciated.

Re: Electrical Mods Questions
CoastalCruiser #288249 08/21/2008 2:26 PM
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The old HD and Triumph ignition systems were not necessarily inferior, but they were really easy to modify. For example, you could get a few hundred more RPMs by simply closing up the points gap to .012 - .014 to increase the dwell angle. It was also fairly easy to modify the '58 - 60 something dual point ignition to a dual fire setup, halving the load on the coils and doubling the dwell time.

There is a guy in (I think) Sweden named Jojji who has hacked into the programming on the ignitor to enhance his drag bikes. Unfortunately for the rest of the world, he won't rework them for other people because of liability issues.

One thing that can be done, but is rather complicated, is to modify the timing lugs on the alternator rotor so that 2 pickups can be used along with 2 ignitors. One of the problems with the 720 degree engines is that the coils are fired twice per revolution as compared to once on the 360 engine. This means that even the best of coils will run out of energy near the present redline.
So it is possible to greatly improve the ignition beyond better coils, wires and sparkplugs, but it involves a lot of work.

1. Hack into the ignitor programming to change the rev limit count and advance curve tables on 2 ignitors.
2. Find a place to mount the second ignitor and change the wiring to connect each to just one coil.
3. Make room in the engine side cover to mount a second timing sensor and mount one.
4. Modify the alternator rotor to trip each ignitor once per revolution. Both timing lugs will have to be shortened, one on the outside and the other on the inside to trip only one of the sensors. The outer lug may have to be extended, depending on how the mounting of the second sensor works out. An alternative is to remove the second lug altogether and mount the second sensor exactly 90 degrees off from the original. This will require a serious modification to the cases to provide a place to mount it.

Another possibility would be to design up an entirely new ignitor that starts out firing both cylinders together like the stock one. It would then count out the timing difference between each timing pulse until it can be certain which is left and right, then switch to a single fire mode. Add in a set of advance curves addressed according to RPM and TPS reading. Or else use a very fast processor that can calculate the advance delays directly without using lookup tables.

So, as you can see, the new ignition system can be greatly improved, it's just not all that easy.


Let's hope there's intelligent life somewhere in space 'cause it's buggar all down here. -- Monte Python
Re: Electrical Mods Questions
Greybeard #288250 08/21/2008 11:46 PM
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Greybeard-

Thanks for the technical input. I really appreciate you taking the time to respond in such detail.

I noticed you are from Clovis. I used to live in Las Cruces. Speaking of chile....We actually were roasting some New Mexico green chile yesterday and today.

The wife is stockpiling her cache for the year. We actually have been able to get it from a local grocery store for a decent price.

Have a good one.


Moderated by  bennybmn, chy, mert 

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