Bonneville America Forums Forums Technical Forums General Tech Novice Question Regarding Starting

Bit of a novice question so i apologise if i'm missing something simple (like the fact i don't need to have capital letters for every word in a title).

I've recently got hold of a Bonneville America 07, rather cleverly before i actually have hold of a bike licence.

Anyway, i've turned it on a few times and had the standard cheeky ride in the car park just off my street (the family are/were all bikers so i know some of the basics already) and from the fact that it was serviced just prior to me getting hold of it and that it seemed to be running fine i can assume it's in reasonably good health (it's just under a year old).

Anyway, i had a mate around and was showing him the bike. Went through the usual process of switching her on except this time it struggled to catch.

realising i hadn't been paying attention i hadn't pulled the choke out, no biggie.

so i go through the whole process again, this time choke out but instead all i get is a grinding/tapping noise from the central body of the bike when i press the ignition switch, and no other life.

anyone want to hazard a guess at what i've done? or am i missing something rookie simple?

as i said, i _assume_ it's in good working order as i got it from a reasonably reputable dealer (and it was serviced before i got it)...

i've got a reasonable grasp of engineering (i'm rebuilding an old MZ at the moment...don't ask) but obviously limited bike skills (or skillz for the under 17)

Cheers for any help,

Anthony

Make sure it is not in gear, and also that the kill switch is switched the right way.

If the side stand is down and it is in any gear it will not start.. Try them for starters then maybe someone will have posted some other idea

If you got it from a reputable dealer I would take it back to them. I hope you aren't describing the broken starter gear that has been posted about lately. Your description is kind of vague.

Let's hope for a run down battery first, not enough current to engage the starter pinion. Charge the battery and try again.

One other thing:
Do not turn the throttle when starting.
There is a throttle position sensor that changes the ignition advance, and this can cause a backfire.
Just pull out the choke and hit the button.
After the engine fires up you can give it gas.
Don't worry about your questions, everybody was a newbie once, keep asking.

It sounds to me like a low battery condition, and he's
hearing the starter relay clicking (under the rh side
cover I think).

I thought what I did because instead of clicking he said grinding noise. Low battery/bad connection to me would be a clicking noise.

If the battery's just low enough the solenoid can click in & out repeatedly and quickly. This could easily sound like a grinding noise to a newbie. First step is to charge the battery since that's a lot cheaper than pulling the engine apart - always attempt the cheapest fix first unless you KNOW what the problem is.

When you stated "it struggled to catch" how long did you try to turn the engine over? Did it sound like it was stuggling? If it spun over with authority the battery is probably fine. Boost or charge as stated and try again.

If that doesn't work and all your connections are fine, Ian is probably right about bringing it to the dealer for a starter gear and housing change. Should be warranty though.

Thanks for the advice and suggestions so far all,
below is a link to the noise i just recorded this morning (wonders of modern technology), as to whether it's a clicking or a grinding...

The Bad Noise (*.Wav format)

Otherwise, it's in neutral, choke out, kill switch fine, side stand down, no throttle, fingers crossed and lucky pants on.

It's a reputable dealer, however i only have 3 months warrenty with it (though still have about a years Triumph warrenty on it). The 3 months warrenty starting from when the bike was delivered and running out...just before i get my licence (oh ho ho ho!).

Anyone recommend a reasonable battery charger that's particulaly happy with the Tba?

Thanks for your time and patience on this one,

Anthony

The "Battery Tender" line is a popular motorsports charger
http://www.pacificbattery.com/batterytender0123.html

They are apparently safe for long term trickle charge use as well.

Check connections on the starter and solenoid also make sure there is enough power in the battery

That doesn't sound like a low battery to me that sounds mechanical. Like a slipping bendix or gears not meshing. I could be wrong since I am not listening in person. Does that sound seem to come from under the seat on the right side or from the lower left down by the left foot peg? It could be a solenoid sound but does sound more mechanical to me.

It's all guess work Ian, not having the bike infront of you Ian, with a bit of luck one of us may just hit it on the head with all the ideas..

Keep us informed Anthony..

I agree but the location of the sound may help. If it is down near the foot peg then it's most likely mechanical and inside the primary if it's up high on the right side then the noise is coming from the solenoid. And any problem is hard to diagnose from a distance. I remember ED and I trying to help Tom out through a zillion PMs. Tom didn't know the bike yet , it was new to him and it turned out to be a combination of several small easily corrected problems that a novice would know even when looking right at them. In the end it took him bringing the bike to me and maybe an hour or so straightening them out and then we rode the rest of the day.

Cheers guys,

The noise is coming from under the seat (ish) area on the right hand side. If i was more specific i'd say it was around or near the casing area with the 'America' relief on it.

I'll go on the scrounge for a charger today, one of my mates may well have one. I'll give that a try first off.

Thats a good thing, that cover pulls off easily and under that is the solenoid. The solenoid is metal with 4 wires going to it. 2 held on with nuts and 2 plug on wires. Undo those and clean all the connections and charge your battery.If the problem persists you probably need to replace that,kind of expensive from Triumph but can be replaced with an automotive one if you know how or know someone with that knowlege.

EDIT: Do not jump your bike off of a car it can damage your charging system.

It does sound like a low battery to me. Charge the thing and see if it doesn't take care of your problem.
The loud buzzing sounds like the starter solenoid.. remove the right side cover and follow the two large wires and see if that is not the beastie making the noise.

Yeah, it's a low battery. I have gotten used to operators describing the sound of a solenoid clicking in and out as grinding, rapping, etc. Get a Battery Tender, hook it up and you're good. All of my bikes have Battery Tenders, I get max life out of all my batteries.

Thats grand, thanks for the assist guys, settled me down at least (the bike was cheaper than it should have been so i was waiting for the other boot to drop).

I'll blag a charger off my mate (he's got two bikes so i assume he'll have something appropriate) and see how it goes.

+1 low battery.
+1 battery tender.
Also, aux socket & power cable from powerlet: http://www.powerletproducts.com/
The socket goes into the top rear motor mount.
There's a connector for it on the harness.
Cable is for patching battery tender to socket.

I'd never stopped to ponder why a solenoid will chatter on a low battery, but heard it explained a while back.
The battery has enough juice to activate the relay, which causes a voltage drop that makes it release.
Repeat ad buzzium.

Now if this had been a week or so ago I'd say hot foot it down to lidl and get a charger ar £4.99.
I'm not expert, but know how a flat battery sounds and how you described it - that was how I would describe it.

I would charge it up and see how it goes - once you've passed your test. If it seems to be a problem get a new battery, it'll save hassle in the long run. Also if you are not gonna ride every day then think about an Optimate - what the guys above call a tender. Just plug it in at the end of the day and it keeps the battery in top condition.

Quote:

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2007 Triumph America...and no bike licence... (dumb dumb and dumber)

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Not dumb, dumb and dumber.....when I put the deposit down on the 03 I hadn't passed my test either....I just then continued and failed first time. But passed 2nd time around...I was lucky enough that I was still trundling around on my 125....but every time I went past the dealer I could here her calling...

Just a quick update note to say thanks all for the kind help, battery charged to full and bike started first time.

1.5 months until i can legally ride it!
possibly a bit longer until i can _actually_ ride it with confidence though!

For reference, i ended up with the Optimate that Gina referred too (UK based and next day delivery sinched it), worked fine and looks like a reasonable bit of kit.

Thanks again all, both for the advice and encouragement.

Anthony

Wow, sounded like the batt. was good at first then like there was lots of juice still but wasen't engaging the starter properly.Might want to get a few more responces off here then bring it back before the warenty is up.Sounds like a starter problem,good luck,and keep us posted.

Ah good fix,how many people change there starter only to find the battery is a little weak.

I believe it is the battery, my TAB needed a new battery, would not hold a charge for very long. I could ride for several miles, then stop for one hour if stopped for more than three hours just the grinding sound you described. TIME FOR A NEW BATTERY, OR PERHAPS YOU ARE NOT RIDING LONG ENOUGH BETWEEN STARTS TO RECHARGE BATTERY. Use a tickler or battery charger then see how long battery holds the charge.