 Life is cheap.....
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OP
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If you do it today you MIGHT regret it. If you CAN'T do it tomorrow you WILL regret it.
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Re: Life is cheap.....
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Joined: Oct 2007
Posts: 1,680
Learned Hand
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Learned Hand
Joined: Oct 2007
Posts: 1,680 |
Quote:
Judge Francis Gilbert said: "Given that the defendant has already been in custody for many months, that is a far greater punishment than he would get for death by careless driving.
Rubbish, either way you look at it.
Thom
I might be wrong, I sometimes am.
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Re: Life is cheap.....
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Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 20,096 Likes: 2
Fe Butt
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Fe Butt
Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 20,096 Likes: 2 |
Well Brummie, you've good reason to be mad as h*ll here, but you know, we take our lives in hands every single time we jump on these machines of ours. And I wonder if you'd be as angry at reading the news of this if this couple had died while behind the wheel instead?
I don't neccessary think your courts think "Life is cheap", or any cheaper for us motorcyclists, but I do think if the guy who caused this accident were DRUNK at the time, even a LOS ANGELES Jury would have found him guilty of "cheapening life".
It appears this accident, and that's what it appears it was here, was caused because the sober driver, ONCE AGAIN(and remember the report here stated that "the couple's bike was in a dip in the road"..."didn't see the motorcycle coming"...which as you know, happens all the time, and unfortunately happens a lot of times to good people just like these two folks.
If it were a member of my family? Yep! I'd be pretty upset about it, alright. But, as I stated above, we should all know the risks by now about riding these kinds of vehicles with their lack collision protection, but I for one think the feeling of "freedom"(for want of a better word) I receive from riding my Triumph around the streets surrounded by all the cagers out there far outweighs it's inherrent liabilities.
Take care, dude.
Last edited by Dwight; 01/25/2008 12:48 PM.
Yep! Just like a good Single Malt Scotch, you might call me "an acquired taste" TOO.(among the many OTHER things you may care to call me, of course)
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Re: Life is cheap.....
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Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 7,701 Likes: 22
Monkey Butt
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Monkey Butt
Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 7,701 Likes: 22 |
Quote:
At the time of the collision Mr Navratil had been in Britain for only a few months after being recruited from the Czech Republic to work as a driver in PlymouthQuote:
Huh? Recruited? I had no idea there was 0% unemployment in your country. That may be a problem, what side of the road do they drive on in the Czech republic? If they normally drive on the right he may have had a lapse.
I try to aggravate one person a day. Today may be your day.
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Re: Life is cheap.....
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At first I kind of looked and thought hmmm a bitty racist but every day it just seems to be a bit more truthful. I cross ocean, poor and broke. Take bus, see employment folk. Nice man treat me good in there. Say I need to see welfare. Welfare say, "You come no more, we send cash right to your door." Welfare cheques - they make you wealthy! NHS - it keep you healthy! By and by, I get plenty money. Thanks to you, you British dummy! Write to friends in motherland. Tell them "come fast as you can." They come in turbans and Ford trucks, And buy big house with welfare bucks! They come here, we live together. More welfare cheques, it just gets better! Fourteen families, they moving in, but neighbour's patience wearing thin. Finally, British guy moves away. Now I buy his house,then I say, "Find more immigrants for house to rent." And in the yard I put a tent. Everything is very good, and soon we own the neighbourhood. We have hobby, it's called breeding. Welfare pay for baby feeding. Kids need dentist? Wives need pills? We get free! We got no bills! British crazy! They work all year, just to keep the welfare running here. We think UK darn good place. Too darn good for British race! If they no like us, they can scram. Got lots of room in Afghanistan ! 
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Re: Life is cheap.....
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Joined: Oct 2005
Posts: 3,463
Loquacious
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Loquacious
Joined: Oct 2005
Posts: 3,463 |
Round here (and Devon isn't that far away - about 50 mins on the motorway) we couldn't get bus drivers. Now I'm having to use the bus as my physio has banned me from riding and half the bus drivers are Polish. It's going the same way with taxis. The Devon roads are a lot like the Somerset roads and are very twistyturny and have 10ft hedges either side. Most 'sensible' people if following a slower vehicle wait their turn and crawl along the roads. It is annoying, but the safest option. The taxi driver will just see crawling as wasting time to get back and make more money. As he'd only been in the Plymouth area a couple of months he wouldn't know the roads round there....and these are the consequences.
That and I'm sure the Czech driving test is no where near as strict as it is here....
Gina
03 America - Pretty stock - except the TBS wheel... 
06 America - missing, presumed in bits. With it's TBS wheel... 
09 America - It's very blue....
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Re: Life is cheap.....
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Joined: Jul 2006
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OP
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My post was in no way meant to be racist or anti-foreigner. My anger is on a few levels.
1. The Crown Prosecution service couldn't get the case to court in time.
2. Causing death by careless driving (Was) treated so leniently. (New laws permitting gaol terms for causing death by careless driving were immediately watered down because our gaols are overflowing.)
3. The taxi driver was overtaking at speed on a blind bend and was on the wrong side of the road so should have been found guilty of dangerous driving.
I've driven in many countries on the Right and as long as I have got a Left hand drive car it is VERY difficult to make a mistake, even more so on a single track road.
And yes, I would be as angry if the couple had been in a car, on horseback, on bicycles, or walking, and any age, race, nationality, colour or creed. It's one thing getting wiped out when you are being stupid, but when you are obeying the rules and then get wiped out by someone who lies about what happened (re: witnesses didn't see the car he supposed to have 'overtaken' because it brake hard in front of him.) then points of law should not let the killer escape punishment.
Last edited by Brummie; 01/25/2008 8:56 AM.
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Re: Life is cheap.....
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Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 732
Adjunct
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Adjunct
Joined: Jan 2005
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Brummie - I'm with you here..... #1 - if the Crown Prosecution is anything like our system, the courts are clogged, the prosecutor has too many cases, and the defense atty takes advantage and manages to delay the case multiple times and the court lets him/her do it. At least here in the US that delay caused by the defense doesn't count against the state, and we can still proceed with a case beyond the "statute of limitations" for that kind of reason, but if he's done as much time in jail as he would have if convicted, he gets out here too. 2 & 3. I see the "too lenient" sentence here all the time for these kinds of cases, even when the driver at fault is drunk!!! Makes me bonkers!  Course sometimes its impossible to convince a jury of the fault....having picked a number of juries it still surprises me sometimes that as a group of citizens they let people off that clearly were in the wrong criminally - it just takes one juror to tip the scales in the defendant's direction, whereas I have to have all of them agree to get a conviction. Course, I won't talk about the sentencing judges.......  All done! Becky
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Re: Life is cheap.....
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Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 2,968 Likes: 1
Loquacious
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Loquacious
Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 2,968 Likes: 1 |
That's a crime against humanity and a terrible injustice.
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Re: Life is cheap.....
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Joined: Jul 2006
Posts: 763
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Quote:
My post was in no way meant to be racist or anti-foreigner. My anger is on a few levels.
Brummie
sorry if my post inferred in any way that I thought you were being racist. 
It just seems that in the news lately we are seeing more and more immigrants in our country who flout the law and get away with it.
If we say anything about foreigners the politicaly correct brigade jump up and shout racism. When do we finish with the racism labels and begin to look at the countries resources. Our health service is stretched to breaking point. Our jails are overflowing and our public sector housing is almost non existant. This is not wholy down to immigration but is part of a bigger picture due to lack of guidance from our political leaders.
So Brummie please accept my apologies.
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Re: Life is cheap.....
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Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 221
Adjunct
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Adjunct
Joined: Jan 2006
Posts: 221 |
Quote:
Well Brummie, you've good reason to be mad as h*ll here, but you know, we take our lives in hands every single time we jump on these machines of ours. And I wonder if you'd be as angry at reading the news of this if this couple had died while behind the wheel instead?
I don't neccessary think your courts think "Life is cheap", or any cheaper for us motorcyclists, but I do think if the guy who caused this accident were DRUNK at the time, even a LOS ANGELES Jury would have found him guilty of "cheapening life".
It appears this accident, and that's what it appears it was here, was caused because the sober driver, ONCE AGAIN(and remember the report here stated that "the couple's bike was in a dip in the road"..."didn't see the motorcycle coming"...which as you know, happens all the time, and unfortunately happens a lot of times to good people just like these two folks.
If it were a member of my family? Yep! I'd be pretty upset about it, alright. But, as I stated above, we should all know the risks by now about riding these kinds of vehicles with their lack collision protection, but I for one think the feeling of "freedom"(for want of a better word) I receive from riding my Triumph around the streets surrounded by all the cagers out there far outweighs it's inherrent liabilities.
Take care, dude.
I agree, well put Dwight.
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Re: Life is cheap.....
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Joined: Jul 2006
Posts: 879
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OP
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No mate, it wasn't any reference to your reply. I just wanted to emphasise that it was the offence and the fact that he got off on a point of law. rather than who paid the price. I understand Dwights point of view as well, he believes it was an accident, but to me, saying that we must accept the fact that as motorcycle riders we should expect to get hurt by bad drivers seems like blaming a woman for getting raped or a child for being molested. As for immigration - oops, sorry - MIGRATION to the UK as we must now call it, at the rates sustained over the previous 10 years in particular, would seriously damage any social infrastructure even if it were confined to healthy and skilled people who spoke the language and were employable and self supporting. The annoying thing with the EEC is that one of it's prime objectives is to provide work and business for the member countries. Countries like Poland are losing their skilled workers who come to the UK to drive buses while they have to recruit dubiously skilled labour from China ! I don't remember China joining the EEC ? 
If you do it today you MIGHT regret it. If you CAN'T do it tomorrow you WILL regret it.
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Re: Life is cheap.....
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Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 20,096 Likes: 2
Fe Butt
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Fe Butt
Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 20,096 Likes: 2 |
Well Brummie, kind'a sort'a in a wee little way I'm saying every adult is somewhat responsible for their fate, but your example using women and children there is quite a leap.
But, now that I've re-read this thing again, I agree with you that if the Czech driver did perform an unsafe manuever purposely, than he does deserve some measure of punishment. And thus, as I said in my opening line, I can see why you're upset about your legal system's "loop-holes" for want of a better term. But as I also said, I wonder if you'd still be as angry about this if those people were not a fellow motorcyclist, for as I believe everbody who dies out there under these kinds of situations deserve and equal about outrage directed toward those possibly responsible.
But maybe you do feel that way also, and if that is indeed the case, I'm sorry if I might have misread your intentions here.
Yep! Just like a good Single Malt Scotch, you might call me "an acquired taste" TOO.(among the many OTHER things you may care to call me, of course)
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Re: Life is cheap.....
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Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 8,639 Likes: 3
Old Hand
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Old Hand
Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 8,639 Likes: 3 |
Quote:
As for immigration - oops, sorry - MIGRATION to the UK as we must now call it,
Isn't interesting how politicians and business majors feel that renaming something will somehow make it better? There was a move in L.A. a couple years ago to rename Central Avenue because that would make all the problems in the South Central area go away. Saugus/Newhall in California was renamed Canyon Country, Kmart changed their name to Big Kmart and changed the color of their logo when they were having financial problems, etc. Oh, and personnel departments were too personal, so they were renamed 'human resources'. Many companies have renamed employees "associates", etc.
Let's hope there's intelligent life somewhere in space 'cause it's buggar all down here. -- Monte Python
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Re: Life is cheap.....
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Joined: Jul 2006
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OP
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It was a bit over the top using a rape and child molestation analogies, but I think you understand what I was trying to say. I did say in my previous post: "And yes, I would be as angry if the couple had been in a car, on horseback, on bicycles, or walking, and any age, race, nationality, colour or creed" I'm sure the guy didn't go out to kill anybody but he drove recklessly and folk died. Maybe international drivers licences are too easy to get..... 
If you do it today you MIGHT regret it. If you CAN'T do it tomorrow you WILL regret it.
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Re: Life is cheap.....
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Joined: Sep 2005
Posts: 3,816
Freelance Jedi Knight
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Freelance Jedi Knight
Joined: Sep 2005
Posts: 3,816 |
Quote:
Countries like Poland are losing their skilled workers who come to the UK to drive buses while they have to recruit dubiously skilled labour from China !
and that is funny never ever seen chinese driver in Poland they would not handle Polish reality of public transport 
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Re: Life is cheap.....
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Joined: Jul 2006
Posts: 879
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OP
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Quote:
Quote:
Countries like Poland are losing their skilled workers who come to the UK to drive buses while they have to recruit dubiously skilled labour from China !
and that is funny never ever seen chinese driver in Poland they would not handle Polish reality of public transport
from the news.......
Deputy Labour Minister Kazimierz Kuberski said the opening-up of the labour market is a response to the needs of the Polish economy.
Even though it has the highest unemployment rate in the European Union, Poland is experiencing chronic labour shortages, especially in construction and agriculture.
And knowing the American Polish jokes....I had to smile..
....Poland fears EU brain drain...... 
So you haven't seen the new Polish buses ?
Here's the interview for recruiting the drivers !
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OPLMGsxnpZM
If you do it today you MIGHT regret it. If you CAN'T do it tomorrow you WILL regret it.
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Re: Life is cheap.....
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Joined: Sep 2005
Posts: 3,816
Freelance Jedi Knight
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Freelance Jedi Knight
Joined: Sep 2005
Posts: 3,816 |
out of subject
Problem in Britain is that we poles have mostly bad press here last week on of the newspaper said that 1300000 came from my country last year!!!!! what a buIIshit !!!! others saying that we overtaking british jobs another lie..... Gordon said that need to create 500000 new jobs for brits but what about vacanciec companies have already....every firm I worked here struggles to get skilled people even last week had a phone call from Wales they want me back there and straight agreed my conditions.....
there is too many British born people here they just do not want to work is too easy to get benefits this country is just to socialistic
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Re: Life is cheap.....
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Joined: Jul 2006
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OP
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Quote:
there is too many British born people here they just do not want to work is too easy to get benefits this country is just to socialistic
We are all members of the EEC, I personally think it has been and will continue to be bad for GB and is impoverishing us, but as we're in it we need to make sure it works for the benefit of us all.
My point was that jobs in the UK are going OUTSIDE the EEC (India, Malasia etc) and countries like Poland - who also have the highest rate of unemployment - have to recruit from outside the EEC.
Your refer to 'the jobs that 'UK workers don't want', isn't it the same in Poland ?
The problem is they don't pay enough to live on, either here or in Poland. As for lack of skills, again employers aren't prepared to pay for them.
It's no wonder for example, that Polish teachers coming here are earning 7 or 8 times the money labouring on building sites.
I have lots of friends in the building trade in particular and they are all struggling to find work because they are being undercut by migrant workers. It's no good telling them that they should work for less, the employers should pay more.
I don't know about state benefits, I've retired due to ill health (cancer) and I get sweet F*ck All after paying into the system all my working life (41 years).
Sadly we are all pawns in the system. I used to get so wound up about the rich and famous avoiding paying their taxes. Now seeing what the government waste it on, I think "good on you ! I only wish I could do the same.
Good luck to you mate if you've found a better life for you and yours. There is a long tradition of friendship between the UK and Poland and long may it continue.
In Birmingham most of our bus drivers are Polish. The problem is most of them don't speak English yet, so it's no good getting a bus unless you know the route and fare !
If you do it today you MIGHT regret it. If you CAN'T do it tomorrow you WILL regret it.
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