Bonneville America Forums Forums Rider Safety Forums Legislation New Helmet Law In NC

Read in today's Greenville (SC) News that effective 1/1/08 North Carolina will not only require helmets but that the helmets be DOT approved.
Without getting into the politics of helmet wear/not wear, I wonder how they plan to enforce this. Decals proclaiming 'DOT' are widely available for any novelty helmet, after all.
SteveB

Prior to the helmet repeal here in Florida, the cops rarely pulled you over just for having a non DOT helmet. But they would give you the ticket along with whatever they pulled you for in the first place. Fake DOT stickers were probably a 50/50 chance of being too much bother...

later, Tom.

Won't be moving to NC now.

In Australia there is a small external label that indicates the helmet meets Australian Standards. It is segmented so its very difficult to remove and place on a different helmet. Also would be difficult to reproduce.

This argument is typically in the Legislation section but I fully support helmet laws. I agree that anyone should do what they what... Unless it affects someone else. The fact remains that non-helmet use accidents typically increase medical expenses which would increase premiums (thus affecting many individuals).

Australia has mandatory helmet laws for bicycles as well and thank god for that. I had an accident 10 years ago where I lost it coming around a turn on a gravel patch doing 45km/hr. Head hit the edge curb, split the helmet in two and I was unconscious for 2min. would not be alive to tell the tale.

Watch out, next is the law against fat people. Obese will be a class A felony with a penalty of gastric banding.

Alcohol! Down with it! Oh, we did that once, didn't work out.

CT's law is a little weird, you do not have to wear a helmet, but if you choose to wear one it must be DOT approved.Guess that's keep folks from riding round with football helmets and such.

Well I do not believe in the government telling me what to do but I could really care less about helmet laws as I choose to wear one no matter where I ride.
I think if you choose to not wear a helmet your insurance should be increased 10 times or maybe no personal coverage.

as far as enforcing the non-DOT thing. I see TONS of brain buckets out and about in NY. I would think it would be the kind of thing they couldn't really pull you over for, but if they pulled you over for something else and found it non-DOT, then you'd have a ticket. That sort of thing.

Cody, its PIP (personal injury protection) and MedPay (medical payments coverage) that if carried (mandatory in some states) covers injury specific to the operation of the vehicle. Those insurances do exist and are widely used. Many carriers won't offer them for bikes but many will.

The health carrier is excess over them or primary if there is no other valid collectible insurance.

The health carriers and safety groups forget to tell you that stuff. It is their self interest not rates. Check back in a year in NC and see how much they cut health premiums
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Get the rates on fat, diabetic smokers and heart attacks or type 2 diabetes. Helmets are maybe $1.00 a year in excess exposure over the big deals. Why no laws on fat smokers who eat and drink like sugar factories? (because the masses won't tolerate it!) They attack the minorities who are too small to fight back in the filthy world of lobbying.

The government has no place in this. None at all, it is contrary to what they were designed to provide.

I'm not referring to any medical insurance, my job pays for that anyway. I'm referring to the lawsuits that happen from injuries in accidents. My sisters x was in laconia years back with his buddy. They were all excited because they could "ride free". Well he dropped his bike at 5mph, smacked his head and went braindead. His wife meanwhile wins a few million from lawsuits. That contributes to "my" insurance costs. Not that I even really care because I think bike insurance is pretty cheap.

As far as head injuries, I use to be a medic and have cleaned brains off the street a few times, I'll keep my helmet on.

And for helmets causing accidents, well I have seen plenty of sunglasses that restrict vision more than any fullface, I have seen guys with no helmets or pots with no eye protection at all and I have personally been bug eyed while wearing an openface with glasses.

Wait a minute. The wife sued and got millions because her husband wasn't wearing a helmet? How did that work?

I'm not debating whether helmets are a good idea or not. I'm not debating whether helmet laws are right or wrong. I'm not questioning your choice to wear a helmet, and I can appreciate the reasons you stated for wearing one. I am challenging people who say that helmetless riders cause them to pay higher insurance premiums. When I hear someone say that, I say show me the proof.

Everyone has their stories, but in this case anecdotal evidence is not proof. I can tell you several stories where I think my helmet did almost cause me to have an accident. There are stories in the forum archives about riders who had neck injuries that were probably caused by wearing a helmet, but that isn't proof that insurance premiums are being impacted.

I want to see a study with true measurements of cause and effect, or a statement from an insurance company stating the statistics they are using to adjust their premiums, or even an insurance application form that asks if you wear a helmet. Until I see that, I say there is no proof, and premiums are not being impacted in any measurable way.

BTW, I care a great deal about the cost of insurance. I care about vehicle insurance, and I especially care about health insurance. Since I am currently a student and not working, I pay 100% of my premiums out of my own pocket. Health and auto insurance are a big chunk of my budget. Insurance costs are one big factor that may keep me from staying in school. And since I feel I can only afford insurance with very high deductibles, I pay 100% of my doctor visits and prescriptions. I find it a little troubling that some people say so casually that I should pay 10 times more for insurance.

I'm not trying to start an argument here. I have just heard the statement many times that "helmetless riders are costing me money". Sometimes it's said with some vitriol, as if it's costing a LOT of money. I don't think the statement has any basis. I don't think it's true and I think it should be challenged.

Regards, and ride safe.
Cody

Cody, you are paying no more money because of helmet laws or the lack of them. Its an excuse for health carriers to push rates and send their lobby to get lids on folks. There is not one bit of valid data to justify rate increases across the board or rate reductions that never happen. Since when does the government care about insurance? Its the mind your business lobby that gets that stuff done.

Look at the rates on the big fast sport bikes. Way higher than our bikes. That is outrageous! 99% of those guys are wearing full face lids and leather at 150MPH, they should never get hurt with the helmet on should they? Why are sport bikes double the insurance? Everybody knows with leather and a lid you simply cannot get hurt unless you pass light speed.

Driving conduct and the horses available are what kill riders. 50% that die are drunk. Well goshiegee ossifer I only had 8 wittle beers but I gots me lid on, yup.

Lids are a personal choice. As above, I think I would have to move

Lets see, in my accident last year I wasn't wearing a helmet but, very luckily had no head injuries. Just mangled ankles. This cost my auto insurance max limits on my uninsured motorist policy and collision. Cost my health insurance God knows how much cumulatively to fix my legs and get me walking again. (They're still paying for physical therapy over a year later.)

Now if my brain would have got splattered right there on the road, I imagine my health insurance would have got off a lot cheaper.

Point being: I don't think a helmet-less biker is necessarily more expensive than a helmet wearing one in an accident.

Funny how you can live in a state and not know what's going on. Personally I don't care as I always were a full face filp up anyway. I do own a couple of novely helmets. They make neat flower pots. About all they're good for IMO.

Many moons ago when CT made seat belt usage in cars mandatory. We were lead to believe by both the insurance companies and the gov. That it would cause rates to drop.
Well guess what? That turned out to be just so much bulls***.

Any sugjestion that a mandatory helmet law will make bike insurance drop, Is just so much more bulls***.

It is a 2nd offense law only...meaning the police can not pull you over for your non DOT approved helmet, but if you get pulled over for something else, they can write you a ticket. -If the cop knows what he(she) is looking for.

A DOT sticker?

and awaayyyyy we go

I think the costs saved by the Dead on Arrivals would probably offset the cost of long term care for helmetless riders.

There a lot of brain bucket/ novelty helmets sold here in NC. It's pretty obvious that they would not pass DOT. I haven't seen anyone with a novelty helmet that had put a DOT sticker on it. I believe there would be additional penalties involved if you are caught with the DOT label on a non-DOT helmet.

There's been a loophole in the NC law because existing law says:

"helmet of a type approved by the Commissioner of Motor Vehicles."

This posed a problem because they were not specific about DOT approval. Technically, a helmet was a helmet... the new law addresses this issue.

In MA if you're caught without a D.O.T. helmet...the LEO will write you a ticket...BUT then they can REFUSE to allow you back on your ride...no helmet you see...so you eithe sit by the road while someone BRINGS you a legal helmet OR you leave your ride to go get one...