 Aftermarket CDI
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Joined: Jan 2005
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Saddle Sore
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OP
Saddle Sore
Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 5,268 Likes: 16 |
Lot's of threads about this. I've a friend coming over tomorrow night with what I think sounds like a bad CDI.
After riding for a peroid right side cuts out. I'll check it out Friday and see what I think.
Where exactly is this rascal located?
Anyone making these yet?
Mike
Last edited by mikemm03; 07/05/2007 7:49 PM.
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Re: Aftermarket CDI
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Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 4,932 Likes: 2
Loquacious
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Loquacious
Joined: Jan 2005
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we should do this every weekend!
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Re: Aftermarket CDI
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Joined: Aug 2005
Posts: 2,726
Loquacious
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Loquacious
Joined: Aug 2005
Posts: 2,726 |
The CDI is a small box with a large multipin connector and is located under the tank on the left side of the bike. The outputs go to the coils under the tank front on each side. I got mine replaced by my dealer last Spring. If primarily one side is cutting out, try swapping the coils (L-R). If the cutting out moves to the left - it's the coil, if it stays on the right - it's the CDI.
Bob
2005 America, 904cc - sold. 2014 Trophy SE.
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Re: Aftermarket CDI
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Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 5,268 Likes: 16
Saddle Sore
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OP
Saddle Sore
Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 5,268 Likes: 16 |
Thanks Ramsound, great information. One more for you, what role (if any) does the regulator / rectifier play in this role?
Mike
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Re: Aftermarket CDI
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Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 4,072 Likes: 82
Loquacious
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Loquacious
Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 4,072 Likes: 82 |
Quote:
what role (if any) does the regulator / rectifier play in this role?
None.. unless it's a charging system problem.
The ignition system is pretty basic really.. a hall effects switch (pick up coil behind the right side engine cover)sends the pulse to the cdi that Grounds the coils to make the spark.
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Re: Aftermarket CDI
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Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 5,268 Likes: 16
Saddle Sore
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OP
Saddle Sore
Joined: Jan 2005
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Hey Chy, how's it going friend. I had my pick up coil replace under warranty a couple years back. By bike acted as it were starving for fuel. Would cut completely down then come back to life. No problems after the that.
My friends bike is cutting out on the right side.
I'm leaning to the CDI unit but we'll see after I check the coils. I'm hoping we find something different. He has around 55000 miles on the bike.
Mike
Last edited by mikemm03; 07/05/2007 9:55 PM.
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Re: Aftermarket CDI
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Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 4,072 Likes: 82
Loquacious
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Loquacious
Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 4,072 Likes: 82 |
I was wondering what had taken care of your problem.. hopefully it'll be a coil or spark plug wire issue... fingers crossed.
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Re: Aftermarket CDI
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Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 5,268 Likes: 16
Saddle Sore
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OP
Saddle Sore
Joined: Jan 2005
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Well my bud got lucky. Turns out to be a fuel issue.
The boy had what looked like mud pack in the bottom of his fuel tap. Clean her up, she runs like a top and I get dinner and beer.
Ah yes we're both happy.
NO I didn't clean the little hidden fuel filter. The bike was hot. What a stupid place to put that thing anyway.
I took mine out and threw it in the trash a long time ago.
Mike
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Re: Aftermarket CDI
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Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 5,268 Likes: 16
Saddle Sore
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OP
Saddle Sore
Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 5,268 Likes: 16 |
Guess I need to resurrect this thread. My bud is still having issues. I thinking it may be the pick up coil.
The bike acts like it is statrving for fuel, then comes back to life.
I had very similar problems on my 03. My pick up coil was replaced under warranty after 6 months, no problems after.
**How can we test the pick up coil in my friends bike to see if it is working properly?**
Mike
Last edited by mikemm03; 07/24/2007 5:03 PM.
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Re: Aftermarket CDI
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Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 691
Adjunct
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Adjunct
Joined: Feb 2005
Posts: 691 |
A little off of your question, but a recent thread about a factory notice mentioned that the pickup gap should be .8mm rather than the manual's .8 to 1.2mm range. They said that after making this change in production, they have had no more claims or investigations about coils not working.
Also,if a timing light were alternated between both spark plugs and showed a difference (since there is only one pickup coil under the alternator cover) a coil or plug or the CDI could be malfunctioning (at that time!!) but the pickup coil would be okay.
--Tom
02 TBA; 130 mains; TBS; Nology Coils&Wires;Unifilter/opened Airbox; -AI/snorkels; -2 baffles;Progressive 440s & Springs
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Re: Aftermarket CDI
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Joined: May 2007
Posts: 6,432 Likes: 1
Worn Saddle
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Worn Saddle
Joined: May 2007
Posts: 6,432 Likes: 1 |
Quote:
The bike acts like it is statrving for fuel, then comes back to life.
And did you get him to pull the hidden filter after it cooled down?
A positive attitude may not solve all your problems, but it will annoy enough people to make it worth the effort. Herm Albright (1876 - 1944)
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Re: Aftermarket CDI
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Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 9,223
Big Bore
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Big Bore
Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 9,223 |
Hey Mike, neither manual gives a spec for the coil but you can trace the wires up to a two pin connector and ohm the coil. It should show some resistance (a few ohms perhaps) but should not be a dead short or open (I'd measure it hot and cold). Connector is under the seat.
"Never underestimate the power of human stupidity" - Robert Heinlein
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Re: Aftermarket CDI
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Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 5,268 Likes: 16
Saddle Sore
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OP
Saddle Sore
Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 5,268 Likes: 16 |
Quote:
And did you get him to pull the hidden filter after it cooled down?
Oldroadie, she is loosing fire. I do not think is fuel related now.
Mike
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Re: Aftermarket CDI
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Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 5,268 Likes: 16
Saddle Sore
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OP
Saddle Sore
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Thanks, Phil. I'll check it out.
Mike
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Re: Aftermarket CDI
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Joined: Jan 2005
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Saddle Sore
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OP
Saddle Sore
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Phil, what became of your firing problem. The bike not your job  Mike
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Re: Aftermarket CDI
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Joined: May 2007
Posts: 6,432 Likes: 1
Worn Saddle
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Worn Saddle
Joined: May 2007
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I think Phil narrowed it down to the ignitor. Both cylinders? Plugs tell you anything?
A positive attitude may not solve all your problems, but it will annoy enough people to make it worth the effort. Herm Albright (1876 - 1944)
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Re: Aftermarket CDI
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Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 9,223
Big Bore
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Big Bore
Joined: Jan 2005
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It is definitely the ignitor Distilled, I swapped out mine for Matt's while she was symptomatic. She ran perfect with Matt's and like crap with mine. Swapped a few times to be sure and I am 200% sure.
"Never underestimate the power of human stupidity" - Robert Heinlein
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Re: Aftermarket CDI
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Joined: May 2007
Posts: 6,432 Likes: 1
Worn Saddle
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Worn Saddle
Joined: May 2007
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There's also this thread on the pickup sensor gap Triumph Update that addresses a misfire issue...
A positive attitude may not solve all your problems, but it will annoy enough people to make it worth the effort. Herm Albright (1876 - 1944)
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Re: Aftermarket CDI
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Joined: Feb 2007
Posts: 23,217 Likes: 61
Fe Butt
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Fe Butt
Joined: Feb 2007
Posts: 23,217 Likes: 61 |
has anyone had an ignition issue and tried to adjust the gap before replacement? I was wondering if that would cure it or if once the damage is done it's done.
I learned all I need to know about life by killing smart people and eating their brains.
Eat right ,Exercise ,Stay fit, Die Anyway!
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Re: Aftermarket CDI
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Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 9,223
Big Bore
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Big Bore
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I REALLY wanted that to be my problem... 
"Never underestimate the power of human stupidity" - Robert Heinlein
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Re: Aftermarket CDI
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Joined: Feb 2007
Posts: 23,217 Likes: 61
Fe Butt
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Fe Butt
Joined: Feb 2007
Posts: 23,217 Likes: 61 |
I take it you tried that first.
I learned all I need to know about life by killing smart people and eating their brains.
Eat right ,Exercise ,Stay fit, Die Anyway!
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Re: Aftermarket CDI
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Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 9,223
Big Bore
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Big Bore
Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 9,223 |
Naw, but the symptoms led me to suspect the CDI in the first place. Turning the key off and then on again after she failed got her going for a bit. After a couple of miles of this up north (and I've only had worse miles on my old two strokes with fouled plugs ), she'd settle into a steady off/on intermittent state. Down here in the heat, it only took about 3/4 mile to start failing. Got back to the house, dismantled, and swapping in Matt's CDI produced a perfectly running bike! If that had not produced those results, I would have definitely suspected the pickup coil.
"Never underestimate the power of human stupidity" - Robert Heinlein
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Re: Aftermarket CDI
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Joined: May 2007
Posts: 67
Member
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Member
Joined: May 2007
Posts: 67 |
It could be some CDI unit are more senistive than others and sensitivity is changed by heat I would certainly change the gap on the sensor before dropping the big dough for a new CDI. When Triumph says they have had zero problems since reducing the gap it sounds like they were just operating outside the parameters for the sensor input signal.
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Re: Aftermarket CDI
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Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 9,223
Big Bore
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Big Bore
Joined: Jan 2005
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Without changing the coil/gap and with just changing the CDI, the problem goes away. I highly doubt it's the pickup coil/gap.
"Never underestimate the power of human stupidity" - Robert Heinlein
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Re: Aftermarket CDI
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Joined: May 2007
Posts: 6,432 Likes: 1
Worn Saddle
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Worn Saddle
Joined: May 2007
Posts: 6,432 Likes: 1 |
I've been following Phil's saga, his diagnostic steps were right on the money and I'm certain he's correct. I'm curious now as to whether the pickup coil gap is the root cause of the ignitor failure to begin with and, if so, shouldn't we all re-gap our pickup sensors to be on the safe side? Wonder what Triumph has to say about this?
A positive attitude may not solve all your problems, but it will annoy enough people to make it worth the effort. Herm Albright (1876 - 1944)
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Re: Aftermarket CDI
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Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 9,223
Big Bore
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Big Bore
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I plan on checking/gapping to that new spec before the new CDI is installed but I doubt if it actually causes failures. I mean it only sends a pulse to the CDI so if the gap was too much, it just wouldn't send it...
"Never underestimate the power of human stupidity" - Robert Heinlein
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Re: Aftermarket CDI
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Joined: Jan 2005
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Should be Riding
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Should be Riding
Joined: Jan 2005
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You know that a spot on test would have been to put your ECU in someone's else's bike after your ECU started exhibiting symptoms. This is not to say that your way won't tell you something. But a perfectly running bike that gets only a different ECU and then won't run will tell you it is indeed the ECU. Putting a cold ECU in your bike tells you that a cold ECU works in your bike. You rule out any and all extraneous factors with the first method. A fine point? Perhaps even moot. 
Blowing gravel off rural roads
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Re: Aftermarket CDI
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Joined: May 2007
Posts: 6,432 Likes: 1
Worn Saddle
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Worn Saddle
Joined: May 2007
Posts: 6,432 Likes: 1 |
Quote:
I plan on checking/gapping to that new spec before the new CDI is installed but I doubt if it actually causes failures. I mean it only sends a pulse to the CDI so if the gap was too much, it just wouldn't send it...
I agree with that and your summary principle is sound, however, the Triumph statement made me wonder:
Quote:
Since changing the IPU air gap in production to 0.8mm, we have had no ignition coil warranty claims
A positive attitude may not solve all your problems, but it will annoy enough people to make it worth the effort. Herm Albright (1876 - 1944)
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Re: Aftermarket CDI
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Joined: Jan 2005
Posts: 9,223
Big Bore
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Big Bore
Joined: Jan 2005
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I was thinking about that earlier Moe and to be absolutely sure, I have Matt's CDI in there now and if it ever friggin stops raining EVERY afternoon, I will give her a test ride and heat it up good.
Ed, I believe that closing the gap slightly ensures the pickup coil gets energized (and sends the pulse) every time. Sounds like they are saying with a wider gap, the pulse is intermittent (on some bikes) and the fault is erroneously root caused to the coils.
"Never underestimate the power of human stupidity" - Robert Heinlein
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Re: Aftermarket CDI
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Joined: May 2007
Posts: 6,432 Likes: 1
Worn Saddle
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Worn Saddle
Joined: May 2007
Posts: 6,432 Likes: 1 |
Quote:
Ed, I believe that closing the gap slightly ensures the pickup coil gets energized (and sends the pulse) every time. Sounds like they are saying with a wider gap, the pulse is intermittent (on some bikes) and the fault is erroneously root caused to the coils.
I have to remind myself from time to time that we really don't speak the same language over here... 
A positive attitude may not solve all your problems, but it will annoy enough people to make it worth the effort. Herm Albright (1876 - 1944)
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